Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 [2] 3  Send TopicPrint
Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) lube problem?... (Read 15050 times)
.22-5-40
Oldtimer
*****
Offline



Posts: 828
Joined: Feb 13th, 2010
Re: lube problem?...
Reply #15 - Jul 22nd, 2016 at 3:42pm
Print Post  
I was using a Lyman 45 lubesizer..sizing/lubing .38 Spec. cast bullets last winter with Micro Lube..a commercial lube I have used for years in revolvers.  I used a light bulb to soften lube as it was a bit chilly in loading room.  Sizer began to cool off & lube stiffen, so I used a heat gun to warm things back up...must of got things a bit too hot, as the  Next thing I know, bullet stuck fast in die.  I had to use an arbor press to get that bullet out!  Now I was only sizing maybe .002" at most.  Figured the heat killed the lube properties.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
calledflyer
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 3981
Joined: Mar 9th, 2015
Re: lube problem?...
Reply #16 - Jul 22nd, 2016 at 6:36pm
Print Post  
John, I know that what you just wrote is true enough- strangely with cast bullets the opposite could be true as well. Goofy ain't they? In my current case there wasn't any visible leading (haven't cleaned it yet, but must not be much if at all)
John Boy, I hadda chuckle when I read yer post. You may be right about the warning of Vaseline in heat. (seems odd that 80 is "high" heat). The chuckle came from the suggestion to add mutton tallow. Nevada ranch ancestry here- no sheep allowed. 
Thanks fer all the help guys.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
calledflyer
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 3981
Joined: Mar 9th, 2015
Re: lube problem?...
Reply #17 - Jul 22nd, 2016 at 8:13pm
Print Post  
Well, I certainly do try to get the most my rifles will allow- considering my own finite skill, this one's been quite generous. I'm more proud of it's ability than my own. John, if you think it's just cast bullet rifles that are quirky, you are leading a sheltered life. Many high power rifles are just as finicky if you want to get the best out of them. 
Here, the mystery of what seems the lube conking out on me is what prompted me asking you all what your thoughts are. I fully expected a range of views. Cast bullet shooters being what we are. 
So far, I don't know if this batch I mixed up is something I can save. But, if some directions to Alberta Schuetzen lube, or Javelina come to me, I'm more than ready to try it. If I can pan lube, anyway. Be good to try something new anyway.
I've got by in good fashion for a long time on this. It stemmed from my old mentor who shot it from the end of ww2 until his passing. He was pretty good, too. I had to change to the liquid alox, but it seemed OK for a long while. Onward, and upward.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
calledflyer
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 3981
Joined: Mar 9th, 2015
Re: lube problem?...
Reply #18 - Jul 22nd, 2016 at 10:59pm
Print Post  
Yeah, John, but I was trying to say that the whole shooting and ammo craft has tricks of the game. Cast is no harder to learn than  the top tier of other disciplines. You must admit that shooting in the threes and loosing at a benchrest match is daunting. Those guys and their equipment is top notch. I tried, and soon found out that I wasn't gonna get too far in the listings. Fun though. And great atmosphere- very laid back bunch. 
High power wasn't for me either. Hurt my body, and those guys are uptight about everything. Everything.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
frnkeore
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 7663
Location: Central Point, OR 97502
Joined: Jun 16th, 2010
Re: lube problem?...
Reply #19 - Jul 22nd, 2016 at 11:08pm
Print Post  
Quote:
But, if some directions to Alberta Schuetzen lube, or Javelina come to me, I'm more than ready to try it.

Our very own JerryH makes it. Send him a PM and he'll get it to you.

Frank
  

ASSRA Member #696, ISSA Member #339
Back to top
YIMAIM  
IP Logged
 
calledflyer
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 3981
Joined: Mar 9th, 2015
Re: lube problem?...
Reply #20 - Jul 22nd, 2016 at 11:36pm
Print Post  
Thank you Frank- I just shot off a note to Jerry.
In fact, let me give a thumbs up to the whole lot who've chimed in  on this. I feel like my favorite child just got sick and you all pitched in to help. 
The patient is recovering. No lead poisoning. Just lousy shooting for all I know. It happens.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
RSW
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 1299
Location: Arizona
Joined: Sep 8th, 2006
Re: lube problem?...
Reply #21 - Jul 23rd, 2016 at 12:16am
Print Post  
After a pesky leading problem with one of my rifles using my old standby Smiley Schuetzen lube, I tried Alberta Schuetzen lube. Leading problem ceased, accuracy was unaffected. The stuff works great. 
In the Az desert it's hot & dry much of the year and this lube stands up well in the heat. I pan lube, always melting the lube with a double boiler.
It's a commercial product so I don't expect the recipe to be online. I bought a coupl'a kilos from Dave and when I run low, I'll buy more.
Try Alberta lube in a 32 cal Ron Smith barrel, it'll bring a smile  Smiley
  

Randy W
ASSRA 10211  -  ISSA 125
There are indeed two Americas. Simply put, it is not the haves and have nots. The two Americans are in reality divided into those who do and those who don't.
Back to top
GTalk  
IP Logged
 
marlinguy
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline


Ballards may be weaker,
but they sure are neater!

Posts: 18069
Location: Oregon
Joined: Feb 2nd, 2009
Re: lube problem?...
Reply #22 - Jul 23rd, 2016 at 9:32am
Print Post  
Calledflyer,
I don't have any issues with heat and my lube, but may not have the heat your area has. My ammo is stored in my basement, so never gets over about 75 degrees, even in the hottest days of summer. It does sit out in the direct heat at the range, but not long enough to be an issue. I often don't shoot it all up at the range, but haven't seen any issues from heat.
As for Vaseline, I totally agree it can easily melt. But how much that affects the lube depends on how much Vaseline is in the formula. Since the formula I use has 10% Vaseline, I don't see it as a problem myself.
  

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
calledflyer
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 3981
Joined: Mar 9th, 2015
Re: lube problem?...
Reply #23 - Jul 23rd, 2016 at 12:50pm
Print Post  
My lubed bullets are stored in the house where it's normal temp.
I do fairly small batches of any one slug- sixty or so. Several different slugs may be in storage at once. Maybe a year till the next group of any one  needs to be lubed. Usually the span of time is a lot shorter- a month or two for lube to dry. Is that too long? 
Never outside in hot or cold for more than a few hours, since I'm close to the range. The range is covered, so not much direct sun on the ammo. Or, the barrel for that matter. My barrel in this rifle never gets even more than slightly warm. That's why my worries are more for some other sort of failure here.
My lube has served me in temps from the teens to above a hundred without leading. At least leading that I couldn't trace to a stupid experiment with alloy or velocity. In other words, it's never made me suffer until the other day- so a new direction is appealing to me due to my lack of chemistry.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
calledflyer
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 3981
Joined: Mar 9th, 2015
Re: lube problem?...
Reply #24 - Jul 23rd, 2016 at 12:57pm
Print Post  
This reminds me of a funny, sad story. My old friend had a rifle with his cast bullets out by the river one hot day plinking at whatever struck his fancy. Hot day, like I said.
Soon his rifle started shooting poorly. He finally realized his problem was heat and unchambered his loaded round- to discover that it was free of lube- all melted away in the sunlit rifle's innards. He'd fired a number of wholly naked bullets and ruined his outing that day. One damn good reason for jacketed there, ain't it?
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
John Boy
Ex Member


Re: lube problem?...
Reply #25 - Jul 23rd, 2016 at 2:47pm
Print Post  
I would like to do a comparison between Alberta Schuetzen  stated to be such an excellent lube with an excellent lube that I make and use for all my smokeless & BPCR reloads... offering my lube ingredients to anyone that wants to try it:
* 40% Pure White Mutton Tallow ... with a long hydrocarbon chain mainly of triglycerides (fat), whose major constituents are derived from stearic and oleic acids 
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)
* 40% Fully Refined Paraffin Wax , an alkane with a long hydrocarbon chain
* 15% Beeswax - Chemically, beeswax consists mainly of esters of fatty acids and various long-chain alcohols
* 05% Jojoba Oil  - also with a long hydrocarbon chain that was a substitute for whale Spermaceti wax 

The benchmark for the quality of the lube is more than 15,000 smokeless and BP 45 Colt reloads shot in a '92 Winchester with no lube starvation or leading in the bore on both hot and cold days!
« Last Edit: Jul 23rd, 2016 at 2:58pm by »  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
calledflyer
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 3981
Joined: Mar 9th, 2015
Re: lube problem?...
Reply #26 - Jul 23rd, 2016 at 2:59pm
Print Post  
John Boy, that's kind of you to offer to the shooters here. 
My science is so weak, that I don't know what those properties you state are. I'm the same way with my medicines- just order 'em up doc, I don't need to know what they mean. 
Until now, it's been a case of so-far-so-good. Now that the lube is in question, I hope it doesn't follow over to my medicine too.  Wink
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Schuetzenmiester
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 6707
Location: Cool Wet Side of WA
Joined: Apr 27th, 2008
Re: lube problem?...
Reply #27 - Jul 24th, 2016 at 1:15am
Print Post  
Dave, Either Ralph or Ken gave me a recipe at least 20 years ago.  It was very hard and black.  Could not pan lube with it. More trouble than I was willing to  go through.  Do you think they might have been pulling my leg a little with the recipe I got?    Roll Eyes
  

"some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
40_Rod
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline


Extremism in the persuit
of accuracy is not a
vice

Posts: 4285
Location: Knoxville, TN
Joined: Apr 20th, 2004
Re: lube problem?...
Reply #28 - Jul 24th, 2016 at 11:21am
Print Post  
A few years ago I decided to make my own lube. To give some background when I started, after trying most of what was out there, I used to use Havalina Schuetzen Lube (Smiley’s formula). I stopped using that when the Alox brand changed hands. The lube was different somehow I can’t explain it. Anyway I switched to SPG. I found that SPG was an excellent lube but it was a little fussy about heat. In southern summers it would start to run. A lot of guys used to carry their bullets in a cooler but that made my beer taste funny. What I wanted was something like a SPG but that would hold up to a little higher melt temp. After some research and experimentation I came up with my Dapper Dan formula. It will barely melt in a double boiler; I have found the best way to melt it is in the oven set at 220 degrees. Most of my 250s have been shot with it. 
Here it the formula, all ingredients except the Crisco are pharmaceutical grade.
2 lbs.      of beeswax
2 lbs.      castor wax
16 oz.      Lanolin oil
16 oz.       Castor oil
1 lb.              White Crisco
Melt in the order given. I'm still using my first batch.

40 Rod
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Schuetzenmiester
Frequent Elocutionist
*****
Offline



Posts: 6707
Location: Cool Wet Side of WA
Joined: Apr 27th, 2008
Re: lube problem?...
Reply #29 - Jul 24th, 2016 at 12:13pm
Print Post  
Dave, He told me I would have to use heat under my lube sizer and could not pan lube. Definitely sounds like there was a public version and a family version  Grin

I have a good "250" lube, but it has to cure for a year on the bullets.  Looking for something I can lube and shoot right away when I run short on "bench rest" bullets. 

I have been going to try Alberta, but it got misplaced Embarrassed  I found it last night  Smiley
  

"some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 [2] 3 
Send TopicPrint