This is a sort-of follow up to the recent posts regarding primers - particularly the post on European primers.

Cabela's now carries Sellier and Bellot primers which are manufactured in the Czech Republic.  I recently bought a brick of S&B LR primers to test and I'd like to share the initial results.

The test rifle is a .32-40 CPA with a Weaver T-36 scope.  The first test was with 14.7 gr. of Winchester 296 and results were not promising.  The best 10-shot vertical dispersion at 200 yards was 1 1/8".  It was downhill from there.  I think I can comfortably conclude that S&B primers are not at all suited for use with 296.

The next test was with 14.6 gr. of AA#4100 and the results were much, much better - see the attached target.  I shot one other 10-shot group with AA#4100 and the vertical held at 3/4".   

The seating force required for the S&B primers is about the same as required for Winchester primers and somewhat less than required for Federal primers.

I'm favorably impressed by the S&B primers. With AA#4100, they shoot as well as Federal GMM's with the added bonus of being priced at only $24.95 per thousand and the added, added bonus of being available.

JackHughs

I was trolling the net today and found a post that linked to a very long article on the net. The article discussed tests that an advanced UK rifleman ran with a .308. He collected data for 16 US and European large rifle primers.

I did not have the attention span to read and comprehend the entire thing so I scrolled to the bottom and looked at the charts.

S&B primers ranked #1 for the best extreme spread and standard deviation.

Sounds good right? The S&B only ranked about the middle of the pack for accuracy.

The Remington 9.5 LR primer ranked next to last (and the 9.5M was last) for extreme spread and standard deviation.   

However as a joke on chronograph users the Remington 9.5 LR primer was first in group size accuracy with the smallest groups.

this is a link to the article with the primer rankings
See the very end of it for the ranking charts

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frnkeore wrote on Mar 19^th, 2016 at 5:23pm:


Hi Frank,

Thanks for the load data.  I use a chronograph about once every five years so I don't have much info on velocities and SD's.

I used 14.7 gr. of 296 for this test because this particular rifle seems to like that load combined with Federal 210's.  Apples to apples, and all that.

JackHughs   

I bought quite a lot of S&B primers when Cabela's put them on sale for $19.99/1000.  I bought them because I can no longer get Wolf primers which were the best primers I ever used.  I am happy with the S&B so far.

I like to use a chronograph when changing powders..or powder lots. I check what load gives me near the same velocity as what the bullet I've been shooting prefers...
I also do like to see what the Es and Ed etc are comparing different loads.

Terry

Barrel harmonics can simply be controlled / altered / tuned by where you rest your barrel or place your sled on the front rest. Barrel replacement or machining is not really required. If you are using a sled and have a load that is promising don't just leave it where it is keep moving it fore and aft in one inch increments until you locate the harmonic sweet spot of which your groups will tell you. Common practice is to set it back seven inches from the muzzle and a good place for one to start. Also another critical element to accurracy consistency is rifle recoil balance of which is also often times over looked. If you are to heavy at the end of the barrel the butt will rise off the rear bag under recoil. If to heavy at the butt the barrel will rise / jump/ bounce off the front rest. Both will provide extreme verticle displacement on the target. I it typicaly best to have the weight rest on both ends equal or a pound heavier at the muzzle. The rifle must move back smootly in a straight line in its two resting areas with the least amount of disturbance possible. As Frank pointed out knowing your SD's and ES's may be comforting if on the low end but trigger control, being able to hold exact point of aim, the ability to call all your shots and all of the above mentioned typicaly are far more important. Without it all working in harmony how could one possibly determine a real good load from one that is bad? When it is it is the fellow who can read and adjust to the ever changing present conditions by being able to hold off for them will typically be one of those in the top three at the end of the day or the one at the top. He is also typicaly the one who spends countless hours at the range to get to that point and once there one one must continue to practice on a regular basis to maintain it. It is very seldom that I can hold on the same exact same point on the target during a match to keep up with the ever present changes. One must learn to know exactly where to hold when the wind, mirage and light on the target decides to change or points will be dropped or groups enlarged. High BC's, Low ES's, Heavy Bullets and High Velocity just simply cannot over come those changes / shoot through it and one simply has to know / learn what to do. If one is not a competitor but is simply trying to get the most accuracy out of his rifle all of the above still holds true.

I hope this information was helpful.

JLouis

frnkeore wrote on Mar 21^st, 2016 at 2:37am:


Hi Frank,
I guess I'm going to have to 'fess up here.  That high shot was pure and simple operator error.  I shot a sighter target to adjust my scope before shooting this group.  After making a small adjustment for elevation, I moved to the "record" target without first putting a confirmation shot into the sighter - a first-class rookie mistake!  My first shot went high and then the scope settled down.

JackHughs

Pentz there is a good chance your sweet spot is beyond your CPA forearm due to thier typical barrel weight. Jack Hughes ended up having a longer forearm made for his. How he went about finding his sweet spot is some thing I am not aware of so I can't be of any real help. Jack / Jan has shot over 40ea. 200Yd. 250's in practice some back to back of which I have witnessed and hopefully he will chime in here with some helpful information for you so you might do the same.

I have personaly have never shot off a forearm and have either used a sled or rested the barrel on a sand bag in competition so I only have expertice in those two areas.

I do think if you were to remove your forearm find the sweet spot and then put it back on to meet the rules that you could possibly loose it again so you might want to see what Jan has to say first.

JLouis