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smokless powder (Read 13209 times)

Hank45 Oldtimer Offline Beer is living proof that GOD loves you Posts: 506 Location: MA Joined: Jan 21^st, 2010	smokless powder Jun 5^th, 2015 at 6:44am	Print Post
	When did Winchester start using smokeless powder in their 1885 rifles? The reason I ask is that I own a low wall manufactured in 1898 and I was curious about using some light smokeless loads Thanks for your answer, Hank45


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bpjack Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 3771 Location: East Olympia, WA Joined: May 18^th, 2008	Re: smokless powder Reply #1 - Jun 5^th, 2015 at 11:51am	Print Post
	What caliber? Jack


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BP Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 8039 Location: Westside Joined: Aug 27^th, 2006	Re: smokless powder Reply #2 - Jun 5^th, 2015 at 3:40pm	Print Post
	Hank45 wrote on Jun 5^th, 2015 at 6:44am: When did Winchester start using smokeless powder in their 1885 rifles? The reason I ask is that I own a low wall manufactured in 1898 and I was curious about using some light smokeless loads Thanks for your answer, Hank45 Jack's question is a good one. In the Apr 1894 catalog, for the *hiwall* rifle, WRA introduced the .30 U.S. ARMY cartridge using Smokelss Powder 40grs, Steel Jacketed Bullet 220grs. In the Aug 1895 catalog, WRA introduced the smokeless 22 Short loading, the smokelss 32 WCF (32-20) loading, the smokeless 38 WCF (38-40) loading, and a sprinkling of other smokeless loadings. Additional smokeless loadings for other cartridges showed up at various times in later catalogs. In 1898, WRA issued two different catalogs (Mar and Oct), both of which show the lowwall carbine chambered in 44 WCF (44-40). Both catalogs show a smokeless 44 WCF loading as well. Both catalogs also contain the statement by WRA which says: "Reloading Smokelss Powder Cartridges Impracticable." Don't do it Hank, just don't do it!

	There are three kinds of men: The ones that learn by reading, the few who learn by observation, and the rest who have to pee on the electric fence and find out for themselves. Proud Noodlehead
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westerner Frequent Elocutionist Offline deleted posts and threads record holder. Posts: 12324 Location: Why, out West of course Joined: May 29^th, 2006	Re: smokless powder Reply #3 - Jun 5^th, 2015 at 4:55pm	Print Post
	Hank, your rifle could have been used with smokeless or black powder. If you can't narrow it down any closer, best to use duplex loads and half jacket bullets. That way, you're covered. Joe.

	A blind squirrel runs into a tree every once in a while.
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Rebel Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 4292 Location: Rockets and Race Cars Joined: Mar 9^th, 2015	Re: smokless powder Reply #4 - Jun 5^th, 2015 at 5:38pm	Print Post
	Sage advice Joe.

	WARNING: This post may contain material offensive to those who lack wit, humor, common sense and supporting factual or anecdotal evidence. Let's Go Sonny!
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frnkeore Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 7640 Location: Central Point, OR 97502 Joined: Jun 16^th, 2010	Re: smokless powder Reply #5 - Jun 5^th, 2015 at 5:42pm	Print Post
	Didn't Winchester mark their barrel "Smokeless Steel" if the barrel was made to shoot smokeless? Frank

	ASSRA Member #696, ISSA Member #339
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calledflyer Frequent Elocutionist Online Posts: 3957 Joined: Mar 9^th, 2015	Re: smokless powder Reply #6 - Jun 5^th, 2015 at 7:22pm	Print Post
	Some Winchester barrels are marked with the (varied) maker's nickel steel codes. MNS stood for Midvale Nickel Steel, for instance. These start to show up in the calibers that were initially loaded with smokeless at their introduction. I never saw "smokeless steel" marked on one. That said, I'd shoot them with either powder without fear, using suitable loads. I would not shoot many jacketed slugs down one that didn't have the nickel steel stamp. Or, go with Joe's plan. Pat P.S. Maybe it was Marlin that had the smokeless steel mark?


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JLouis Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 10625 Joined: Apr 8^th, 2009	Re: smokless powder Reply #7 - Jun 5^th, 2015 at 8:17pm	Print Post
	I am not sure of what the real concern is, eveyone one lately seems to be extremely skittish about using an appropriate smokeless load in one of the strongest small shank actions built at the time. Hank didn't even mention what its chambered for so how are you all coming up with your conclusions / recommendations I don't see any real factual basis for them.

	" It Is Better To Now Have Been A Has Been Than A Never Was Or A Wanna Be "
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westerner Frequent Elocutionist Offline deleted posts and threads record holder. Posts: 12324 Location: Why, out West of course Joined: May 29^th, 2006	Re: smokless powder Reply #8 - Jun 5^th, 2015 at 8:25pm	Print Post
	Maybe Hank is trying to be historically correctamoondo. Joe.

	A blind squirrel runs into a tree every once in a while.
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JLouis Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 10625 Joined: Apr 8^th, 2009	Re: smokless powder Reply #9 - Jun 5^th, 2015 at 9:40pm	Print Post
	Sounds to me like he just wants to try some smokless based on his question and everyone that has given their opinion so far has skirted around it and to date no has actually answered it. No one has even taken the time to ask him what its chambered for so they can at least try to provide him with an educated answer so he has a place to start or to consider. A simple question requiring a simple answer. Hank what is your Low Wall chambered for and what are you intending to due with it, breach seating, fixed, competition, plinking or possibly hunting. JLouis
	« Last Edit: Jun 5^th, 2015 at 9:46pm by JLouis »
	" It Is Better To Now Have Been A Has Been Than A Never Was Or A Wanna Be "
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Litl Red Ex Member	Re: smokless powder Reply #10 - Jun 5^th, 2015 at 10:17pm	Print Post
	Actually he asked when did Winchester start building for smokeless. And got a pretty fair answer the same day. He also provided extra info about what he wanted to do.


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JLouis Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 10625 Joined: Apr 8^th, 2009	Re: smokless powder Reply #11 - Jun 5^th, 2015 at 10:30pm	Print Post
	Go back and re-read it, he states clearly that he is curious about being able to use smokless in light loads in his Low Wall and that question has yet to be answered. Hank did not come back and add any additional information so I am not sure how you came up with the comment that he did? JLouis
	« Last Edit: Jun 5^th, 2015 at 10:35pm by JLouis »
	" It Is Better To Now Have Been A Has Been Than A Never Was Or A Wanna Be "
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BP Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 8039 Location: Westside Joined: Aug 27^th, 2006	Re: smokless powder Reply #12 - Jun 5^th, 2015 at 11:11pm	Print Post
	JLouis, Given the info Hank provided, what is your answer to Hank's question, and what particular load do you recommend Hank should use?

	There are three kinds of men: The ones that learn by reading, the few who learn by observation, and the rest who have to pee on the electric fence and find out for themselves. Proud Noodlehead
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JLouis Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 10625 Joined: Apr 8^th, 2009	Re: smokless powder Reply #13 - Jun 5^th, 2015 at 11:29pm	Print Post
	BP I can't even begin to try and provide any load data, Hank did not mention what its chambered for? In regards to using smokless powder for light loads it is very doable if he has a known place to safely start at and that comment I believe is the answer to his original question.

	" It Is Better To Now Have Been A Has Been Than A Never Was Or A Wanna Be "
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JLouis Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 10625 Joined: Apr 8^th, 2009	Re: smokless powder Reply #14 - Jun 5^th, 2015 at 11:40pm	Print Post
	I don't have the knowledge to answer the first part of his question, a search on the internet could possibly be the best way to find the correct answer? JLouis

	" It Is Better To Now Have Been A Has Been Than A Never Was Or A Wanna Be "
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