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Actions: Hoch vs. Miller/deHaas (Read 6960 times)

RayH Oldtimer Offline Posts: 757 Location: Oldest City, FL Joined: Jan 4^th, 2012	Actions: Hoch vs. Miller/deHaas Mar 25^th, 2015 at 8:44pm	Print Post
	Any comparisons/opinions re. suitability for basis of BR rifle?

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frnkeore Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 7627 Location: Central Point, OR 97502 Joined: Jun 16^th, 2010	Re: Actions: Hoch vs. Miller/deHaas Reply #1 - Mar 25^th, 2015 at 10:38pm	Print Post
	My vote is for the Hoch. If the rifle is built right, there will be no accuracy difference. But, the biggest advantage the Hoch has over the M/D is the trigger. I bought mine in '87 as a kit. After making everything fit, it has worked, ever since. In all those years, the trigger only malfuntioned once and that was because it had gotten full of crude. I cleaned it and it was back working as before, with a 10 oz trigger pull. I've cleaned it a couple more times since to prevent that from happening again. Mine is a USA and Meacham changed the trigger (as I understand) but, the USA trigger is easy to adjust and you can get a very light trigger. It may be a little harder to make a BSer for the Hoch but, that's about the only negitive thing I can say. My Hoch is pictured in my Avatar. Frank

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JLouis Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 10625 Joined: Apr 8^th, 2009	Re: Actions: Hoch vs. Miller/deHaas Reply #2 - Mar 26^th, 2015 at 1:13am	Print Post
	The Miller is a far superior action than the Hoch with out a doubt and that is why they command such a high price and they are precision works of art. Becareful if you choose to buy a Hoch, allot of them were kit actions prior to Meacham buying Hoch out and there are allot of poorly put together actions out there and I have seen several. Even the completed actions from Meacham would be like comparing a high end Ferrari to a high end Chevrolet. The gentleman who now owns the Hoch's rights made some significant improvements but he is not offering any for sale. I believe due to the overwhelming hoops he has jump through to be able to is simpily not worth it. JLouis

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40_Rod Frequent Elocutionist Offline Extremism in the persuit of accuracy is not a vice Posts: 4285 Location: Knoxville, TN Joined: Apr 20^th, 2004	Re: Actions: Hoch vs. Miller/deHaas Reply #3 - Mar 26^th, 2015 at 9:05am	Print Post
	The Hoch is an excellent action. The fly in the ointment is that a large number of them were kits. How good the action is was dependent on how good a machinist built them. Some are very well built and some took a left hand turn through Harlow Parkenfarker’s shop. Millers on the other hand were all built in a shop and most were built by the Miller family. The actions are well built but the triggers are notorious. Every time I see a problem on the line with a Miller It’s the trigger. You pays your money you takes your chances. 40 Rod


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Schuetzendave Frequent Elocutionist Offline Retired Ex-Shooter Posts: 4228 Location: St. Albert, Alberta Joined: Jan 28^th, 2005	Re: Actions: Hoch vs. Miller/deHaas Reply #4 - Mar 26^th, 2015 at 1:04pm	Print Post
	I have owned both. The Hoch did not have an adjustable trigger. Some people installed Canjar triggers. The Miller had at least three different triggers. Mine was a later one and must be kept clean or it develops a creep. Many Hoch kits were not hardened and the lever and the block swivel, the pin holes and pins would wear. Hochs were great if the trigger was modified and they were properly hardened. Hochs will shoot as well as the finely machined Miller. My Hoch sear had a modified sprue to let off at nine ounces and it had a great trigger after it was modified. Hoch kits were one third the cost of buying a Miller. Tommy Mason was developing a special Hoch rimfire action. Unfortunately his design conflicted with some other patent. Tommy no longer makes up Hoch actions but may sell to someone who way be interested in building the old Hoch receivers. I shoot a Miller now.
	« Last Edit: Mar 26^th, 2015 at 8:44pm by Schuetzendave »

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RayH Oldtimer Offline Posts: 757 Location: Oldest City, FL Joined: Jan 4^th, 2012	Re: Actions: Hoch vs. Miller/deHaas Reply #5 - Mar 26^th, 2015 at 6:25pm	Print Post
	I own a rifle (.25-20WCF) with an original Hoch action (as opposed to the Hoch/Meachum). The trigger is very nice. Stock is strictly offhand. How do I determine whether or not to make a dedicated BR rifle using this action as the base? Or should I just keep this rifle as a "plinker" or "loaner" and wait until I can find a suitable Miller?

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Myers Senior Forum Member Offline Posts: 389 Joined: Mar 5^th, 2013	Re: Actions: Hoch vs. Miller/deHaas Reply #6 - Mar 26^th, 2015 at 7:57pm	Print Post
	I have both Miller's and a Hoch. They both shoot good. I quit having any trigger issues in the Miller's after cleaning them. Spray them liberally with aerosol Break Free and let it sit overnight on a paper towel. Following day use an air compressor and blow the remaining oil out. Now all internal trigger components are lubricated. I always clean my Jewel triggers between matches. Why should a Miller trigger be any different.


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Schuetzendave Frequent Elocutionist Offline Retired Ex-Shooter Posts: 4228 Location: St. Albert, Alberta Joined: Jan 28^th, 2005	Re: Actions: Hoch vs. Miller/deHaas Reply #7 - Mar 26^th, 2015 at 8:50pm	Print Post
	There are always a few Millers for sale every year at the ISSA Nationals at Raton in August. If you are going to spend money on a new stock and barrel to build a bench rest rifle; you may wish to pick up a Miller instead that is already converted for your needs. The Hoch does make a good bench rest rifle too; once you rebarrel, replace the wood and free float the forearm. Of course before you do that; make sure you have an extractor for the chamber you will be re-barreling the rifle to. Tommy Mason may be able to assist you with an extractor.


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jfeldman ASSRA Board Member Offline Posts: 1115 Location: Imperial Beach, Ca Joined: Nov 5^th, 2005	Re: Actions: Hoch vs. Miller/deHaas Reply #8 - Mar 26^th, 2015 at 8:50pm	Print Post
	Check out some of Donn Hanks' scores. He shoots a Hoch action with an RKS barrel and does very well. I shoot a Hoch with a Douglas barrel and have shot 4 or 5 249's and one 250 at Raton. Oh yes, it is stocked for offhand, with a rounded fore stock. I think if it is barreled up square to the breechblock, it will shoot. Regards, Joe


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cmargs Junior Member Offline Posts: 61 Location: madison,OH Joined: Jun 18^th, 2008	Re: Actions: Hoch vs. Miller/deHaas Reply #9 - Mar 26^th, 2015 at 9:07pm	Print Post
	I own 3 millers and have not had trouble with any, and have shot the tar out of them. KNOCK ON WOOD. cmargs.


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