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Hydrogen Peroxide & Vinegar to Remove Lead in Bore (Read 15304 times)

Cat_Whisperer Frequent Elocutionist Offline No 1, 9.3x74R Posts: 3984 Location: Mountains of Virginia Joined: Apr 17^th, 2004	Re: Hydrogen Peroxide & Vinegar to Remove Lead in Bore Reply #15 - Mar 16^th, 2015 at 5:28pm	Print Post
	BP wrote on Mar 14^th, 2015 at 4:48pm: Quote: ... Vinegar is a acid And it works well for roughening up the surface of old worn knife sharping steels to restore their usefulness. I just use a coarse sandpaper - two or three passes does it; learned it from a meat cutter. Two kinds of steels - very smooth or with grooves. The one with grooves is for beef (coarser) and the smooth one for ham.

	Cat Whisperer (trk) Chief of Smoke Pulaski Coehorn Works and Skunk Works Drafted May 1970, Retired Maj. U.S.Army assra #9885
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Mick B Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 1007 Location: 19 Ian Nicol St watson ACT aus Joined: Apr 11^th, 2013	Re: Hydrogen Peroxide & Vinegar to Remove Lead in Bore Reply #16 - Mar 17^th, 2015 at 9:04pm	Print Post
	I've been following this thread on Peroxide and vinegar to remove lead in barrels. What I want to know, is it the peroxide or the vinegar , or the combination of both that is causing the metal oxidation. A simple test would be to weigh three balls of steel wool and wash them clean as test samples. Then one ball could be immersed it straight peroxide, the other in vinegar, and the third in the mixture of vinegar and peroxide. At the end of a set period, say 10 hours, each sample could be washed clean and re weighed to determine which had suffered the most oxidation loss. I recall reading an article in "Muzzle Blasts " by the Bevel Brothers where they tested a bore solvent that is popular with the M/L fraternity consisting of equal parts peroxide, Murphy's Oil Soap and ethyl alcohol. This testing was to determine what effect the solution may have on a soft steel barrel in a M/L rifle. The result was that after soaking a piece of steel for a few days in the solvent, no damage was visible. Someone less lazy than myself may care to follow up on my suggestion, like Wayne, as for me I'm saving my vinegar for my chips. Mike.


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Aonghas Ex Member	Re: Hydrogen Peroxide & Vinegar to Remove Lead in Bore Reply #17 - Mar 19^th, 2015 at 10:09am	Print Post
	Redwing wrote on Mar 16^th, 2015 at 3:57pm: Sooo, I have an old cap lock (150yrs plus)that had numerous repair's (solder) done to its internal parts !!! Is this a way to clean them off without heat for a proper Tig welding job ??? TIA.... Redwing !!! Most muzzle-loaders were put together with solder, and welding would reduce any value greatly. On an old gun there is no proper TIG welding job. I have to confess to resoldering a poorly-preserved cooking model using tinman's solder and a tiny oxy-acetylene flame... -- Aonghas


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Redwing Oldtimer Offline Posts: 586 Location: Canton Joined: Nov 4^th, 2007	Re: Hydrogen Peroxide & Vinegar to Remove Lead in Bore Reply #18 - Mar 19^th, 2015 at 10:58am	Print Post
	Hi Alonghas !!! I'm aware that TIG was not invented during the repair to the internal failure's and so they are not visible once assembled !!! My attempt to return this old guy to a working condition... The break's are impossible to clean and this sound's like a method I could use !!! This is unique Boy's Rifle that is an in-line Cap-Lock M/L with "Flobert" furniture that the late Turner Kirkland (DGW) and I had many conversation's about... So, I would like it working again !!! Thank's for your imput..... Redwing....


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rkaires Frequent Elocutionist Offline No Stronger Bond Posts: 1672 Location: Dingmans Ferry, PA Joined: Oct 26^th, 2012	Re: Hydrogen Peroxide & Vinegar to Remove Lead in Bore Reply #19 - Mar 19^th, 2015 at 12:49pm	Print Post
	Mick B wrote on Mar 17^th, 2015 at 9:04pm: I've been following this thread on Peroxide and vinegar to remove lead in barrels. What I want to know, is it the peroxide or the vinegar , or the combination of both that is causing the metal oxidation. A simple test would be to weigh three balls of steel wool and wash them clean as test samples. Then one ball could be immersed it straight peroxide, the other in vinegar, and the third in the mixture of vinegar and peroxide. At the end of a set period, say 10 hours, each sample could be washed clean and re weighed to determine which had suffered the most oxidation loss. I recall reading an article in "Muzzle Blasts " by the Bevel Brothers where they tested a bore solvent that is popular with the M/L fraternity consisting of equal parts peroxide, Murphy's Oil Soap and ethyl alcohol. This testing was to determine what effect the solution may have on a soft steel barrel in a M/L rifle. The result was that after soaking a piece of steel for a few days in the solvent, no damage was visible. Someone less lazy than myself may care to follow up on my suggestion, like Wayne, as for me I'm saving my vinegar for my chips. Mike. Hi Mike, I've used the same mix of peroxide, Murphys oil and rubbing alcohol solvent in my Flint longrifles and military muzzle loaders for years with no ill affect. Vinegar for sure will etch steel. I think it works great for giving a barrel or knife blade a nice aged patina. Just be sure to plug the muzzle and vent so it won't enter the barrel. Bob

	ASSRA #11031 NRA Life Proud Noodlehead "Peace is that brief, glorious moment in history, when everybody stands around reloading."~ ~ Thomas Jefferson
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Schuetzenmiester Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 6707 Location: Cool Wet Side of WA Joined: Apr 27^th, 2008	Re: Hydrogen Peroxide & Vinegar to Remove Lead in Bore Reply #20 - Mar 19^th, 2015 at 7:37pm	Print Post
	rkaires wrote on Mar 19^th, 2015 at 12:49pm: Mick B wrote on Mar 17^th, 2015 at 9:04pm: I've been following this thread on Peroxide and vinegar to remove lead in barrels. What I want to know, is it the peroxide or the vinegar , or the combination of both that is causing the metal oxidation. A simple test would be to weigh three balls of steel wool and wash them clean as test samples. Then one ball could be immersed it straight peroxide, the other in vinegar, and the third in the mixture of vinegar and peroxide. At the end of a set period, say 10 hours, each sample could be washed clean and re weighed to determine which had suffered the most oxidation loss. I recall reading an article in "Muzzle Blasts " by the Bevel Brothers where they tested a bore solvent that is popular with the M/L fraternity consisting of equal parts peroxide, Murphy's Oil Soap and ethyl alcohol. This testing was to determine what effect the solution may have on a soft steel barrel in a M/L rifle. The result was that after soaking a piece of steel for a few days in the solvent, no damage was visible. Someone less lazy than myself may care to follow up on my suggestion, like Wayne, as for me I'm saving my vinegar for my chips. Mike. Hi Mike, I've used the same mix of peroxide, Murphys oil and rubbing alcohol solvent in my Flint longrifles and military muzzle loaders for years with no ill affect. Vinegar for sure will etch steel. I think it works great for giving a barrel or knife blade a nice aged patina. Just be sure to plug the muzzle and vent so it won't enter the barrel. Bob I used that Muzzle Blasts mix too for many years on flinters and BP Cart rifles. No problems. I moved on to Glass Plus when I found out it worked just as well

	"some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence
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UtahDave Senior Forum Member Offline Posts: 396 Location: Heber City, Utah Joined: Aug 14^th, 2010	Re: Hydrogen Peroxide & Vinegar to Remove Lead in Bore Reply #21 - Mar 20^th, 2015 at 12:21am	Print Post
	Gents, The peroxide oxidizes the lead and the vinegar (acetic acid) forms lead acetate which is soluble in water. It takes both to remove lead. Peroxide in the muzzle loader cleaning formulas is to react with the nasty product of black powder, potassium sulfide (K2S). The reason black smells when you clean it is the formation off hydrogen sulfide, rotten egg smell, and these sulfide are really corrosive to steel. The peroxide makes sulfuric acid but it is really dilute. Some put a bit of ammonia in the mix to neutralize the acid but I think good washing and rinsing plus oil is just fine. I think hot water is the best cleaner for black. I suspect mechanical removal of lead, turpentine and tight patch, is better than aggressive solvents...then there is liquid mercury which really works well! Dave


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JerryH Frequent Elocutionist Offline ASSRA Member #10876 Posts: 1323 Location: Easton, CA Joined: Nov 9^th, 2014	Re: Hydrogen Peroxide & Vinegar to Remove Lead in Bore Reply #22 - Mar 20^th, 2015 at 1:26am	Print Post
	Liquid Mercury Mad as a Hatter comes to mind. I still say use a good lube and don't have leading problems. JerryH

	I'm not a complete idiot, some of my parts are missing.
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Aonghas Ex Member	Re: Hydrogen Peroxide & Vinegar to Remove Lead in Bore Reply #23 - Mar 20^th, 2015 at 9:16am	Print Post
	Redwing wrote on Mar 19^th, 2015 at 10:58am: Hi Alonghas !!! I'm aware that TIG was not invented during the repair to the internal failure's and so they are not visible once assembled !!! My attempt to return this old guy to a working condition... The break's are impossible to clean and this sound's like a method I could use !!! This is unique Boy's Rifle that is an in-line Cap-Lock M/L with "Flobert" furniture that the late Turner Kirkland (DGW) and I had many conversation's about... So, I would like it working again !!! Thank's for your imput..... Redwing.... Be careful what you weld, and the material you use to do it with - some cast steels cannot be properly welded with ordinary mild steel rods/wire. Cast iron, for instance, should only be welded using cast iron rods, or joined by brazing or 'welding' with nickel. If the gun is of any value (monetary or interest) it might pay to have an assay done on the metal to be repaired, and a really competent welder will reccomend the grade of rod or wire to do the job. If you haven't tried draw-filing, this is the favourite method of hand-finishing a job. Worth reading-up and practising. You need first-cut files for this. (I spent a bit of time draw-filing a round barrel to flared octagonal...) A tip I got from a (very good) gunsmith: if you need to replace parts of a lock, use an annealed file. Even sears and ledges will require no re-hardening. And I sometimes make springs from the tines of old garden forks. -- Aonghas


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frnkeore Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 7627 Location: Central Point, OR 97502 Joined: Jun 16^th, 2010	Re: Hydrogen Peroxide & Vinegar to Remove Lead in Bore Reply #24 - Mar 20^th, 2015 at 12:47pm	Print Post
	JerryH wrote on Mar 20^th, 2015 at 1:26am: Liquid Mercury Mad as a Hatter comes to mind. JerryH That's what must have happened to me. As a kid, I broke up thermometors and used the Mercury to rub on Penneys, then put them on the RR tracks and flatten them. No one would tell me the it would do this to me. Frank

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