Aren't you guys glad I stsrted this thread on a cold snowed in weekend ?

Boats

As OldWin said, DT did a disservice by preaching the small calbiers as the end all to replace the .45-90.  He ended up going to .45-90 himself eventually.

I myself own and shoot two .45-90's.  Given everything else equal, I'll shoot them in preference to the .38's, of which I also own two.  The 38's offer considerably less recoil.  That's their advantage.  However, to take advantage of that in long range shooting,must have a fast twist to shoot longer bullets to the same ballistics as the .45-90.  What you give up in going to a 38 is the ability to spot hits or misses easily to call the shot.  I think that's why the 38's don't show up in the top as much as the 45's.  People try them, find they are hard to spot, and go back to .45's.

The problem when we have this discussion is we always mix up 3 things, and each camp argues their version of one of the 3, so everybody is arguing apples to oranges to bananas.  If you separate the 3 issues, they are:

1)  Long range shooting of 38's needs longer bullets and faster twists.  schuetzen doesn't.  Silhouette is in between the two.  When we compare schuetzen to silhouette to long range, we end up with meaningless comparisons.  Especially when one guy is arguing his 180 to 220 grain bullet, and the other is using a 365 grain.

2)  .45's are superior in long range to .38's with the same ballistic coefficient not because of ballistics (which are identical) but because of spotting difficulty.  That is a substantial disadvantage to the 38 shooter.
 
3)  Faster twists are ballistically less desirable because of bullet instability.  I don't know on this one, but seems logical.  The question becomes are they accurate enough for the purpose, and are the other advantages enough to outweigh any accuracy deterioration if it exists?

The answer to the question of twist really is:  match the twist to the range and bullet length you wish to use.  The longer the range and the longer the bullet, the faster the twist must be.

dav

Joe

Paper if the range has pits with pulled and marked targets is not a problem. Problem is so many of the long range matches are gong on undeveloped ranges. Very hard to see the dirt splash from 38 bullets even with good spotting scopes.

Our Club has a back berm at about 600. Main line is at 500, the ram rails. My 38/55 indicates bullet strikes OK at 500 if they land in the dirt near the rams.    Back berm that has some vegetation imposable to see strikes off of our steel buffalo (always shot offhand)  45 shooters get enough bullet splash to spot even on poor berms at 600


Boats

I remember one year at Heals on Vancouver Island, a shooter couldn't get on paper at 1,000.  I was watching between  spotting my shooter.  I finally saw a splash on the 200 yard berm.  It was grass like a lawn.  I doubt I would have ever caught it if it hadn't been  a .45 

Same here, hard to even walk the dog it's so icy.

Been in my shop loading shotgun shells. Count is near 2000 this morning. 4 gauges 20 through 10 regular and spreader Black powder & Smokeless. All on a single stage.  Like to be able to cast but that's outside for me.   

Weather breaks cast a thousand 300 gr 38s 500 32s

I go outside and cast at minus 10 C.

They cool and drop out of the mold much quicker.

But I have to heat the pot to 862 F. to keep the mold hot enough.

Cast 500 .25, 2700 .32, 1200 .40 and made 400 12 gauge so far.

Here is my casting outfit. Rolling bench. Shop is in a half basement under the house. Smell and smoke rise upstairs if I cast inside.  Outside is good except when the weather is wet. Cold is good Wet is not if something drips into the pot it's a dramatic problem

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)

Gas ring underneath is for Fish Frying not bullet casting

Boats