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.22-5-40
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Bore Dia. unpatched bullets?
Dec 11th, 2014 at 12:33am
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Paul Mathews writes in THE Paper Jacket of using a bore dia. (land-land) bullet before patching using black powder.  He states this is for target use..needing to clean after each shot as opposed to using a smaller unpatched bullet for hunting.  Has anyone used a bullet this large?  I would think a thin patch would be needed?
  
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nuclearcricket
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Re: Bore Dia. unpatched bullets?
Reply #1 - Dec 11th, 2014 at 7:25pm
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General consensus  these days seems to be to patch to bore size with black powder loads and let the bullet bump up. You may more than likely find more information over on the Shiloh board. 
If you want to shoot bore diameter bullets, you will need to keep your patch thickness to grove or less diameter, and that would mean using paper about .002 thick. That would give you 2 wraps that add up to an increase in diameter of .008. You will probably need a tapered throat so that the patch is not torn on loading and/or firing. Since I am not a PP shooter, this is about all the advice I can offer. 
Sam
  
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FITZ
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Re: Bore Dia. unpatched bullets?
Reply #2 - Dec 11th, 2014 at 8:11pm
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I have shot a .45 X 2 7/8" Sharps using the Postell bullet that cast up around .457 Diameter. I Pan lubed them with
Pope lube and then ran them thru a .452 Lube die. We then shot it with Duplex Black powder load of 10 grs 4759 and 100 Grs of Elephant Fg  at 1000 yds. It shot very well indeed. The Postell was 30/1 and 535 Grs. The Rifle weighed about 11 Lbs. Kicked like a Mule. So this was a grease grove bullet with no Paper patch. We ended up with a group at 1000 that measured right around 10" so it will work. HTH Regards, FITZ. Smiley
  

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Brian
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Re: Bore Dia. unpatched bullets?
Reply #3 - Dec 11th, 2014 at 11:38pm
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I shoot a fair amount of pp in 45-70, 45-120 & 50-90 and all my mold designs cast a tapered bullet to be wrapped to bore dia. just behind the o-give to just under groove dia. at base. All are shot w/straight black and all need to be wiped between shots, the paper won't survive the dry fouling. The alloy is critical depending on how close to bore dia. the un patched part of the bullet is (if to soft you get slumping/to much bump up causing the naked part of the bullet to lead the barrel and w/pp that's not as much fun as you would think it to be.    Just my opinion  

   Brian
  
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.22-5-40
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Re: Bore Dia. unpatched bullets?
Reply #4 - Dec 12th, 2014 at 12:31am
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Here is what I have:  Years ago, I had Tom Ballard make an adjustable .399 P.P. mould.  At the time, I had sworn off black, and this was to be used with smokeless in a .40-70 2 1/2".  Slugs drop at .400 with 20-1 alloy.  Now I have gotten back to black..thanks to the Swiss powders..but wondering if mould dia. is too large?  I plan on trying 30-1.  I did try this..took a patched bullet that measured .408" dia., lightly lubed with soft beeswax based lube & ran it thru a Corbin reloading-press type bullet reducing die.  Bullet now had a very hard feel to paper & very shiny.  Bullet dia. over patch mikes .4025".  I unwrapped paper & slug mikes .394"  I wonder if this process will work..could try thinner paper to leave slug larger dia. & dia. over patch smaller?  What do you guys think?
  
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Brian
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Re: Bore Dia. unpatched bullets?
Reply #5 - Dec 12th, 2014 at 11:37pm
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If the patched bullet is swaged down to .4025 and the bullet drops from the mold at .400 depending how fast the o-give drops below bore dia. leading may be a problem w/bump up from bp. Also by pressing the patch on that tight it may stick to the bullet down range causing the dreaded PPF.
  But just because it won't work in my gun isn't saying it won't work in your'es,  you got to try it !!

Brian
  
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MartiniBelgian
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Re: Bore Dia. unpatched bullets?
Reply #6 - Dec 14th, 2014 at 12:53am
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The use of bore-dia bullets patched to groove is pretty normal - in fact, I do it all the time with BP in several rifles.  No tearing of the patch, no  issues with the throat - nothing.
Of course, your chamber should be able to accept the bullet, but if it will accept a groove-dia. GG bullet, then it will also shoot the groove-dia. PP bullet.

Contrary to popular opinion, PP patched to groove dia. was being used quite a lot, even if mostly in the old world.  In actual fact, the last cartridges produced by Kynoch with PP bullets all had bore-dia. bullets patched to groove dia.
Finding paper of the correct thickness isn't all that difficult, and you can always size after patching if it's a bit off.  Actually, you can even patch to somewhere in between without any problems.  .458 in a .462 bore will work quite well indeed.
No need to swage down or perform weird things, just load and shoot.  And wipe between shots, of course...
  
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Re: Bore Dia. unpatched bullets?
Reply #7 - Dec 17th, 2014 at 8:45pm
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.22-5-40 wrote on Dec 11th, 2014 at 12:33am:
Paul Mathews writes in THE Paper Jacket of using a bore dia. (land-land) bullet before patching using black powder.  He states this is for target use..needing to clean after each shot as opposed to using a smaller unpatched bullet for hunting.  Has anyone used a bullet this large?  I would think a thin patch would be needed?


I'm actually using a .454 dia bullet  patched up to .459 in my 45-90. Shoots great. going to do the same with my 40-65 and 40-82 with a .404 dia bullet
  
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