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DWT1885
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Found some .22's
Nov 20th, 2014 at 12:30pm
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Was lucky today and found some .22's at Dick's Sporting Goods. But not all that lucky. First, they would only sell me 3 boxes. Then when I looked close, they only had 40 rounds in each box. These were American Eagle by Federal. All I could do was shake my head. So is this what it's coming to? Same price but instead of 50 you only get 40. Nice going Federal. Unreal. Dale.
  

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SBoomer
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Re: Found some .22's
Reply #1 - Nov 20th, 2014 at 12:50pm
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All the bullet manufacturers have done it for years. I now see some of the bigger (.338's and .358's) in boxes of 25!
  
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broken_arrow
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Re: Found some .22's
Reply #2 - Nov 20th, 2014 at 12:56pm
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Welcome to the "new normal".
  

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frnkeore
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Re: Found some .22's
Reply #3 - Nov 20th, 2014 at 1:02pm
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It's just "Good Ole" American greed. 

Soon they will "out source" the manufactor to China, pay 1/2 as much to have them made, put them in boxes of 20 and charge twice as much as their box of 50.

Frank
  

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QuestionableMaynard8130
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Re: Found some .22's
Reply #4 - Nov 20th, 2014 at 3:29pm
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I'm sure its only a matter of time before Congress under th influence of their lobbies, forces the Bureau of Weights and Measures to reclassify "a dozen" to mean nine.

I believe the a Majority is now defined as the part with the most money.
Oops I should not have posted that here  Grin

maybe  a 240 will end up as a perfect score   LOL   that gets it back to a shooting discussion. 
already we are seeing "match" or "target" ammo that is the same crap they were selling, but with less powder to slow it down to "target velocity" and no improvement to the shot-to-shot quality control.
  

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.22Hepburn
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Re: Found some .22's
Reply #5 - Nov 20th, 2014 at 5:05pm
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? - were the boxes re-sized down from 50 count or are they 50 count boxes with 10 empty spaces? I checked the .22 ammo I have (none is U.S.A.-made) and the boxes are marked "59 cartridges".
  
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.22Hepburn
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Re: Found some .22's
Reply #6 - Nov 20th, 2014 at 5:08pm
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"already we are seeing "match" or "target" ammo that is the same crap they were selling, but with less powder to slow it down to "target velocity" and no improvement to the shot-to-shot quality control".
I'm curious, what ammo would that be?
  
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Re: Found some .22's
Reply #7 - Nov 20th, 2014 at 5:19pm
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I have an unopened brick of Lightning from the seventies.   

Wonder what it's worth now?   


           Joe.
  

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waterman
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Re: Found some .22's
Reply #8 - Nov 20th, 2014 at 5:31pm
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Not familiar with Lightning, but it brings to mind the issue of shelf life for 22s.  In my experimenting with Shorts, I think I am beginning to see a slight decrease in accuracy after 40+ years in storage.
  
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uscra112
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Re: Found some .22's
Reply #9 - Nov 20th, 2014 at 6:31pm
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.22Hepburn wrote on Nov 20th, 2014 at 5:08pm:
"already we are seeing "match" or "target" ammo that is the same crap they were selling, but with less powder to slow it down to "target velocity" and no improvement to the shot-to-shot quality control".
I'm curious, what ammo would that be?


Last year I was doing lots of weighing and measuring of ammo.  (Busman's holiday - SPC was a big part of my career at Zeiss.)   

I rate any ammo as "good" if I can get 45 out of 50 in a box to be +/- 0.1 grains weight on a Pact BBKII digital scale. (i.e., say, 53.0 grains to 53.2 grains.  I'm offering weight as a proxy for overall process control, since it's easy to measure.

My considered answer to the question is: Every American brand except Federal UM22 and 922a, and that may not actually be American.

The only US made "match" ammo I've had that was ever really good was the Federal UM1, now long out of print.   Federal 922a and UM22 tested about the same statistically (weight variance) as Wolf Match. (I've read a rumor that it actually is made on the same mfg. lines in Germany.)  Typically only one or two out of 50 would exceed 0.1 grains variance from average.   

Winchester T-22 "Target" I quit even measuring.  No better than their bulk ammo.  Ditto Federal 711 "Gold Medal".   

Three lots of CCI standard velocity looked OK, but I found two more lots that were less than.  But it's not marketed as "match" ammo, although I see some folks using it. 

Interestingly CCI MinMags had pretty fair numbers for bulk ammo, as did Auto Match. (Better than 45 pieces within +/-0.2 grains for a whole box.)  Not really "match grade" by any means, but a whole lot better than Remington Thunderduds. (+/- 1.5 grains, sometimes more!)

By comparison. the high grade Eley I can't get any weight variance at all - my scale only resolves to 0.1 grains.  100% of five boxes from two lots were all dead on.

Phil
  

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QuestionableMaynard8130
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Re: Found some .22's
Reply #10 - Nov 20th, 2014 at 7:10pm
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My buddy recently bought several newer-production "bulk" boxes (but smaller than the old 525 round boxes we were used to---maybe 300 round boxes) of some sort of Federal that was marked "target" within the past couple months.

He's an experienced shooter but not a target shooter. He used to own a small gunshop here in town and knows I'm always looking out for match or target grade ammo.
  He mostly got them for his grandkids to shoot up when they come to visit, so he checked it in the rifles he lets them use--- 10-22s and another semi-auto of some short. 
  He said they were mostly hitting low; had to drop the crosshairs a couple inches and there were a lot of flyers---ups and downs,  He could hear hear differences between shots.   

He was just happy to find some 22 rf for his grandkids
  

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Re: Found some .22's
Reply #11 - Nov 20th, 2014 at 7:43pm
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OP, Those 40 round boxes of American Eagle are not new. They have been around for at least 20 or 30 years. They are tin can ammo grade. I'm sure the underlying reason then was as you presume now. Somebody buys them because they are the cheapest box to shoot in their 10/22 they bought on sale at WallyWorld. 
The 325 round bulk boxes of Federal Auto Match have also been around for a few years. They are 1200 fps but supposably made to a better spec. and fit better in the "Auto Match" type chambers that are popular in built up 10/22's. I like them in their place, they have improved accuracy in several .22's I have that are not target rifles. I do not know how well they compare to real match ammo in a real target rifle. My target rifle has it's favorite (Eley Target) and I've never thought about using cheaper stuff till now.
kootne
  

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Re: Found some .22's
Reply #12 - Nov 20th, 2014 at 9:27pm
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I bought some ARMSCOR AMMO 22LR 36gr HP HV for practice just because there wasn't anything else available.  The shots sounded different and I can't hear!!  Cry  When I had case separations and gas back through my Ballard, I sent them back.  Always pays to wear safety glasses; yes siree!! Bob  Grin  (pun intended)
  

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DWT1885
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Re: Found some .22's
Reply #13 - Nov 20th, 2014 at 9:28pm
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Hi kootne, Wow, 20 to 30 years? That's the first time I've ever saw them in boxes of 40. It was just a shock to me. Oh well. Dale.
  

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.22Hepburn
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Re: Found some .22's
Reply #14 - Nov 21st, 2014 at 5:33am
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"I rate any ammo as "good" if I can get 45 out of 50 in a box to be +/- 0.1 grains weight on a Pact BBKII digital scale. (i.e., say, 53.0 grains to 53.2 grains.  I'm offering weight as a proxy for overall process control, since it's easy to measure".   
This rules out both grades of Wolf, SK Standard Plus and SK Rifle Match. None of these ammos could be considered "good". This is kind of surprising considering that these ammos are not in the "cheap" category.
  
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