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Flintlock63
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Question, where to start?
Feb 1st, 2014 at 8:47am
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I am new to the forum,  I like single shot firearms and have shot percussion and flintlock muzzleloaders for some time now.  Also have reloaded 12 ga brass shotshells for hunting with an old dbl barrel.  I am thinking about BPCR in 45/70. I am looking for suggestions or opinions on where to look for firearms, what calibers, what reloading gear, etc. might you recommend for a retired newbie to consider without breaking the bank.  I would use the rifle for hunting whitetails and some target shooting.  Thank you for your time!
  
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marlinguy
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Re: Question, where to start?
Reply #1 - Feb 1st, 2014 at 11:18am
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Welcome to the forum. I would start by determining what your budget is first, and then whether your budget (or your desire) is for an original, or modern reproduction. Once you've determined which you want, and a price range, then the search begins. 
There are lots of gun shows around the country, and most of my collection came from these. Also keep perusing your local gun shops, especially those that handle the style of firearm you're looking for. Check the For Sale section here also, as there are some good guns there occasionally, at good prices.
If I was planning to use the gun for some target shooting, and occasional hunting, then I'd probably stick to something in a fairly common caliber. The .45-70 is a good choice, as is the .38-55. If you've not gotten set up for a fair amount of reloading, then an old gun or an odd caliber is definitely not in the equation. Most of these guns will require reloading your own due to limits on pressure levels, or lack of over the counter loaded ammo.
If you can give a little more info on your price range, and capabilities to reload, then might get a better idea of options.
  

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gunlaker
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Re: Question, where to start?
Reply #2 - Feb 1st, 2014 at 11:27am
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One of the big things you'll have to decide is regarding the rifles weight.  Most BPCR target rifles are pretty heavy.  The lightest one I have is a Browning BPCR, I think it'll be just over 11 pounds but I haven't weighed it.  I wouldn't want to go lighter for target shooting.

Chris.
  
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jimmy
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Re: Question, where to start?
Reply #3 - Feb 1st, 2014 at 11:32am
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An example of something I picked up a while back. 
Cimmarron high wall in 40-65 for about half price of new with tang sight. Modern reproduction if you want to go that way. Dies are easy to find and brass made from 45-70 is plentiful.   

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SSShooter
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Re: Question, where to start?
Reply #4 - Feb 2nd, 2014 at 6:03am
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Would consider how much of each (hunting & target) you will shoot. A 45-70 that is light and handy in the field is not a good target rifle at distances over 200yd. Shooting a heavy load while hunting, where you might get off 5-10 shots in a busy day, is nothing like shooting 50-60 shots in 2-4 hours in a match, where the recoil in a light hunting rifle will beat you up. You might want to consider one of the 38cal (38-50 or 38-56 are considerably more powerful than the 38-55 regardless of what is written in a couple of the books) or one of the 40cal (40-65 or 40-70) that are more then adequate for deer and not nearly so punishing when shooting at targets with a lighter rifle. The butt configuration will also make a big difference, with a crescent being about the worst for prone target shooting while being one of the handier ones for the field.
  

Glenn - Stevens 044 1/2, Bartlein SS 5R barrel in 22LR
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Re: Question, where to start?
Reply #5 - Feb 2nd, 2014 at 8:51am
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Good advice one size won't fit all.  Figure the end use first then select the rifle/cartridge 


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MAD MIKE
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Re: Question, where to start?
Reply #6 - Feb 2nd, 2014 at 11:19pm
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TexasMac will probably shine in here, soon. If not google him, I'm sure he'd be very helpful. Good luck.       ...MIKE...
  
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Re: Question, where to start?
Reply #7 - Feb 3rd, 2014 at 8:30am
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I’ll give you the same advice that I give everyone who is just getting started in single shots. Get a CPA, set it up how you think you want it and start to shoot. In my experience almost no one ends up where the thought they would with their first rifle. The CPA has the ability to grow and change as you are pulled one way or the other. CPA’s take a back seat to none in the accuracy department and they are safe. 

40 Rod
  
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Flintlock63
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Re: Question, where to start?
Reply #8 - Feb 5th, 2014 at 7:42am
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Thanks again for all responses!  I have reloading equipt for 12 ga BP but havent purchased anything for rifle cartridge reloading.  Ive spent lots of time looking around the online gun sale sites and other sites.  Lots of possibly " modified " stuff out there.  I was hoping to keep the cost of a rifle from $500 to 800 but wonder if that is realistic for  a good one?  I would not mind a good reproduction.  I will use mostly to hunt whitetails.  Some target shooting , but the close ranges I found are 200yds max and 600 yards max.  at the present time it looks like mostly 45-70s available, found one 38-55 but only a 22 inch barrel.  I will keep trying to listen, learn and look for something that "trips my trigger"!
  
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Re: Question, where to start?
Reply #9 - Feb 5th, 2014 at 9:06am
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How about a Trapdoor? Although a 45-70, a good original or H&R repro are at the top end of your budget and they are generally good shooters. Load it with the 405gr bullet & 55gr of 2F for 200/300yd and only need the heavier bullet/load for the long distances and hunting.
  

Glenn - Stevens 044 1/2, Bartlein SS 5R barrel in 22LR
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Re: Question, where to start?
Reply #10 - Feb 5th, 2014 at 10:40am
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No one ever mentions a Ruger No 1 in 45-70. Not legal in all competitions but a nice rifle and should be able to find in your budget range watching GunBroker.
  
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marlinguy
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Re: Question, where to start?
Reply #11 - Feb 5th, 2014 at 11:28am
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JSB30 wrote on Feb 5th, 2014 at 10:40am:
a Ruger No 1 in 45-70. Not legal in all competitions but a nice rifle 


That's the real issue with a Ruger #1. They are a very well built rifle, and nice looking too, but since they exempt the owner from some events, it wouldn't be my first choice. Better to start with something that wont restrict your choice of shooting events when you're just getting started, and don't know what you may want to shoot.
  

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Flintlock63
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Re: Question, where to start?
Reply #12 - Feb 9th, 2014 at 8:37am
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ANOTHER QUESTION:  what is your opinion on barrel length for shooting BPC?  Looking at some rifles but some have barrel lengths for 22 inches to 28 inches.  Is it adviseable to stay 30 inches or better?  Thank you again for your help!
  
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Re: Question, where to start?
Reply #13 - Feb 9th, 2014 at 11:20am
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In my opinion 30" is a really good choice.  With apperture sights you get good sight radius and the benefit of having 0.01" on the rear sights being very close to 1 minute on the targets.  I have a couple of .38's with 28" barrels that feel better to me for offhand, but in the .45-70 it's nice to have the extra weight of those 2" of barrel.  I don't like longer than 32" personally, although I have a Shiloh in .45-70 with a 34" standard weight barrel.  I bought it used.  If I'd ordered it new, I would have picked a 30" heavy barrel.  34" barrels are a bit unwieldy.

Another factor is that some rifles won't make the legal weight limits with anything more than a 30" barrel.  A highwall can go with a longer barrel, and I imagine that a Stevens could too with no issue.   


Chris.
  
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SSShooter
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Re: Question, where to start?
Reply #14 - Feb 9th, 2014 at 12:11pm
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My Hepburn in 40-65 with a 32" Win #3 1/2 profile full octagon barrel, large globe front and Hoke rear sight weighs 11.5#. The Hepburn action is notably light & strong. The density of the wood can make several ounces difference in the weight on most any rifle. 

Agree that 30" length is an excellent place to start unless you "know something" that makes you want something different. It is pretty much the "standard" length for several reasons for BPCR silhouette. Long enough for a good sight-radius. Short enough to not be a problem for off-hand (think chickens, where matches are won and, mostly, lost) and most rifles (1874 can be a bit of problem) make weight. My 32" barrel is on my BPTR rifle. The BPCR rifle is 30", as are the great majority.
« Last Edit: Feb 9th, 2014 at 2:03pm by SSShooter »  

Glenn - Stevens 044 1/2, Bartlein SS 5R barrel in 22LR
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