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Normal Topic Stevens-Pope 22 Krag conversion barrel ? (Read 6423 times)
Roger G.
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Stevens-Pope 22 Krag conversion barrel ?
Jan 30th, 2014 at 4:09pm
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Hello, I hope this is the correct section for this question. I have been offered a rifle that is represented as a Krag conversion by Stevens-Pope. The receiver doesn't look like any Krag I've seen as it lacks any "side plates". The barrel matches the descriptions that I've read and the sn range is just over 1,###. The overall condition is really nice with great bluing and no rust. The stock has been customized to fit the original shooter with palm swells and finger grooves in the forearm. The price quoted was $1500.00 is that reasonable? Any help would be greatly appreciated.
  
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Old-Win
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Re: Stevens-Pope 22 Krag conversion barrel ?
Reply #1 - Jan 30th, 2014 at 4:56pm
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Not that you won't get help here, but this site deals a lot with O3's and Krag conversions.
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Lefty38-55
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Re: Stevens-Pope 22 Krag conversion barrel ?
Reply #2 - Jan 30th, 2014 at 7:19pm
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Personally, less the pizazz of a Pope barrel and the neat conversion, I feel the owner's customization really put a serious dent into any real collector value and worth.
  

All of my single shots shoot one tiny ragged hole with cast bullets ... it's just the following shots that tend to open up my groups Wink ...
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JLouis
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Re: Stevens-Pope 22 Krag conversion barrel ?
Reply #3 - Jan 30th, 2014 at 7:46pm
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I would suggest posing the question on the Double Gun forum as well as there
several very knowledgable collectors with expertise in your rifles area. 

JLouis
  

" It Is Better To Now Have Been A Has Been Than A Never Was Or A Wanna Be "
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waterman
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Re: Stevens-Pope 22 Krag conversion barrel ?
Reply #4 - Jan 30th, 2014 at 8:30pm
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I have been giving some attention to Stevens-Pope barrels for the Krag.  Carbine or rifle length?

Removing the side plate was a common way of getting rid of the empty cases.  If the feed mechanism (arm, etc) has been left in the magazine, there was a tendency for empty .22 cases to become wedged between the bolt, the inside of the side plate and the feed mechanism.  If you took off the side plate, that problem went away.

Replacement side plates are available.

Is $1500 too much?  There does not seem to be too much information available as to how many were made.  There are not many known survivors, maybe less than a dozen.  If $1500 is too high, it is not excessively so.  If one came my way at that price, I would probably buy it.

Surviving samples of the US Model 1898 Gallery Practice Rifle (about 850 made) bring about $2000 (or maybe more) if in 100 % original condition.
  
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Re: Stevens-Pope 22 Krag conversion barrel ?
Reply #5 - Jan 30th, 2014 at 9:07pm
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I must disagree with Lefty38-55.  This is a very uncommon piece of quasi-US militaria, designed by H. M. Pope, made & marketed by J. Stevens in the 1901-1904 time period.  A Krag so converted, especially if a National Guard conversion (don't know how to tell), is a lot more desirable to a lot of real Krag fanciers than just one more original rifle.

These barrels have a definite link to historical single shots.
If it was not for these barrels, there would never have been any Winder Muskets and probably no Stevens 414s.  Without the impact these barrels had on smallbore rifle shooting, we might never have seen the 1922 series of Springfields or the Winchester 52.

The principal purchasers and converters of these rifles were National Guard units in Ohio, Michigan, Washington State, and (IIRC) Pennsylvania or maybe New Jersey.  The conversions were authorized by National Guard commands at the state level, but the Army Chief of Ordnance decreed that the converted Krags belonged to the US Army and ordered them restored to service standard.

But the Guardsmen trained with the converted Krags shot very much better than any units, Guard or Regular, that had not used the converted Krags.  Not even the Army brass could ignore success.  The Model 1898 Gallery Practice Rifle was produced 1908-1909 for the National Guard, but was too little & too late.  Winchester produced the Winder Musket from late 1904 on, with the first modifications made in response to a request from the Ohio National Guard.  Stevens went after the same market with the 414.

A surviving converted Krag is a real piece of smallbore history.

  
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firearmdoc
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Re: Stevens-Pope 22 Krag conversion barrel ?
Reply #6 - Jan 31st, 2014 at 8:51pm
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I have never seen one of these conversions before. Are there pictures available anywhere of one?

Jesse
  
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Re: Stevens-Pope 22 Krag conversion barrel ?
Reply #7 - Feb 1st, 2014 at 2:46am
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You need to see a close up of the breech with the bolt open.  The photo should show the location of the .22 chamber, being offset to the top.  Another photo should show the muzzle.  Photos of other parts would look like an ordinary Krag, either as-issued or converted.

All the rest is (if a military conversion), made up of standard Springfield Arsenal parts. The action can be any US Krag action.  The bolt is an ordinary Krag bolt, and used an ordinary Krag center fire firing pin.  The regular Krag extractor is used.  The chamber is offset to let the regular extractor grab the .22 rim.  The lower part of the offset chamber lets the regular firing pin hit the bottom part of the .22 rim.

All the external dimensions of the barrels are the same as the standard Model 1898 rifle (30") and carbine (22") barrel.

IIRC, there is a 3/8" dovetail for the front sight.  The barrel should be drilled & tapped for the standard Krag rear (barrel) sight.  There should be a "Stevens-Pope" stamp on the barrel and a serial number on the bottom side.

The Model 1898 Gallery Practice Rifle has an entirely different appearing breech, with an extractor that looks a lot like that on a .22 rimfire Winchester Single Shot.  The GPR action is marked .22 caliber on the left side.  The issue stock will have a "22" stamp.  Other parts may also be stamped 22.  Except for the actions & barrels, the GPRs were put together from left-over or reject parts

GPRs are also found with custom stocks.

  
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Re: Stevens-Pope 22 Krag conversion barrel ?
Reply #8 - Feb 1st, 2014 at 10:39am
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I would buy one of the early Pope Krag conversions in a minute.  1500 is not too much if it's in reasonable shape.

Boats
  
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