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Gone Fly Fishing
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Maynard .38 Cal w/ Conversions
Jan 1st, 2014 at 3:48pm
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  John Bly, I didn't buy this Maynard due to the fact that it had serious "Stress Marks" on the left hand side of receiver starting at the hole for the take down pin and radiating forward of and to the rear of the hole.  The stress was only visible under magnification.

I would have liked to have had it as a shooter, but it had degraded below that category.

How about the gunsmithing necessary to come up with the finger lever latch ?

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C.M.M.
  
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Re: Maynard .38 Cal w/ Conversions
Reply #1 - Jan 1st, 2014 at 4:07pm
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  John B. Per our telephone conversation of this A.M. In the first photo (#95) if you look carefully just in front of the "standing breach" you may see the adapter piece that had been added and attached to the barrel end by the gunsmith and accomplishes two things.  It is a conversion to accept the rim of a 38-55 WCF modern case and it has an extractor "half moon" at the 6:00 O'clock position that is pulled rearward by means of a "thumb latch" to extract the spent casing. 

The other thing is the spring loaded catch that engages a "cut out" in the lower tang which keeps the action "locked up" in the battery position.

I surmise the stress fractures that I witnessed to be from some clueless prior owner firing modern 38-55 ammunition (possibly smokeless) which was way in excess of what the converted/updated (to 1873) 1851 frame could handle.

Best regards for the New Year to Maynard collectors , shooters, and enthusiasts,

C.M.M.
« Last Edit: Jan 1st, 2014 at 5:03pm by Gone Fly Fishing »  
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Deadeye Bly
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Re: Maynard .38 Cal w/ Conversions
Reply #2 - Jan 1st, 2014 at 8:40pm
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Webb, a picture of that Maynard was posted on 12/17 under the Single Shot Rifle topic by graduated peep. After I had spoken with you I remembered seeing a picture of it and I searched and found it.

What was the winning bid? It is certainly an interesting lever arrangement. The home made lever must not cam over center to lock making a locking mechanism necessary.

It is a '73 frame for sure but no .38 calibers were made on '73 frames. The .35 or .36 calibers used bullets as large as .373 diameter so I suppose it was one of those. A '73 would have had a cartridge retractor but it would have been for the thick head cartridge. It appears as if something was added to the rear of the barrel to take up the headspace. You said the cartridge rim was counterbored and the only Maynards with counterbores were the rimfire barrels. There are certainly a lot of questions that come to mind about this rifle. Oh well, it is an oddity and curiosity and it just as well that you passed on it. 
  
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Re: Maynard .38 Cal w/ Conversions
Reply #3 - Jan 2nd, 2014 at 9:12am
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   Good morning John:

   Thanks for your observations and input on the curiosity Maynard.

    You are correct in that the finger lever does not place the action "over center" in the closed position ergo the spring loaded latch which engages into a newly cut hole in the lower tang piece.  If you look at the up-close photo viewing the gunsmith's locking latch you can see the little coil spring sitting there and the small slotted head screw is the "pivot point" for the hook latch that catches onto upper (wood) side of the lower tang.

John, I looked the piece over thoroughly before I called you and could find no I.D.'ing gunsmith's marking on the barrel, which had been shortened to 20 inches, and I believe bored out and cut rifled to .38 cal. and chambered for the contemporary 38-55 WCF.

I did not bid on it for the fact that it had little, if any, collector's value having such radical alterations applied.  The deciding factor for me not bidding was the stress lines bordering on frame cracks and I saw no future for the piece as a "shooter".  It sold for $550. and I would have gladly given more, but for the poor condition of the frame integrity.

Thanks again for your advice.

Webb
  
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graduated peep
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Re: Maynard .38 Cal w/ Conversions
Reply #4 - Jan 2nd, 2014 at 10:38am
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C.M.M.,
Thanks for posting your findings on the modified Maynard. 
I wasn't able to attend that auction and was curious whether anyone from the forums might have had a chance to personally assess the condition of that gun.
  
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Re: Maynard .38 Cal w/ Conversions
Reply #5 - Jan 2nd, 2014 at 12:41pm
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   Grad. Peep :
                     I got there early and went over the piece very carefully before I talked to John Bly on the phone.  I had not seen the catalog photos, just the write up portion nor your posting prior to the sale date, so I was starting from square one at 7:30 A.M. at the sale site.

I hope John didn't mind me phoning at that hour on the morning after New Years eve. If you have any questions, please let me know.

If I can find the time, I will sketch up the adapter conversion piece for reference.

C.M.M.
  
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graduated peep
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Re: Maynard .38 Cal w/ Conversions
Reply #6 - Jan 2nd, 2014 at 12:45pm
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C.M.M.
Thanks for the reply.
When you have time, I would be interested in seeing a better depiction of what was done at the breech.
The online photos were not very helpful in deciding what or how mods were done and to what desired end.
G.P.
  
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Re: Maynard .38 Cal w/ Conversions
Reply #7 - Jan 3rd, 2014 at 10:01am
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This particular Maynard had three dates impressed into the action 1851 and 1859 patent dates and then the 1873 patent date when it was back at Mass Arms for updated modifications.  It was an early Civil War era arm of the percussion cap style originally and later converted to the firing pin style for Maynard head primed style cases.  The Serial No. is 20XX, so that would indicate that it came home from the battlefield with some soldier or it went to the government auction as war surplus.

The barrel was most likely a replacement when it became a 1873 conversion.  I believe what this is about is a '73 sporterized owner visiting his friendly gunsmith with a complain that he could no longer find Maynard "pan head" cases for his beloved Maynard, and the gunsmith indicating "no problem", I can solve that.

The process being, the barrel was shortened at the breech end and a spacer piece was made in the correct thickness in order to set the head space.  There were no pins nor screws attaching the new spacer, so it was silver soldered in place.  
Next a chamber reamer was used to cut the new chamber and the rim recess, thereby eliminating the need for the old style Maynard dish pan head cases which were no longer available.

Of course, the gunsmith then realized what he had done and being a bright young up-start, said to himself, "Self, what's going to keep the breech closed?" So wallah, the finger lever catch mechanism comes to life.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it.    Wink

C.M.M.
« Last Edit: Jan 4th, 2014 at 1:15pm by Gone Fly Fishing »  
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graduated peep
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Re: Maynard .38 Cal w/ Conversions
Reply #8 - Jan 3rd, 2014 at 10:20am
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C.M.M.
Thanks for the "blow-by-blow" description.
I can certainly see why you kept your hands in your pockets, 
and your money in your wallet !
Makes one wonder why it brought as much as it did;except maybe the gunsmith's descendant was buying back great grandpap's handy work..
  
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