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The Saga of My 25-21 Bertram Brass ... (Read 9642 times)

John Boy Ex Member	Re: The Saga of My 25-21 Bertram Brass ... Reply #15 - Oct 16^th, 2013 at 10:08pm	Print Post
	Fred, the brass was annealed by Bertram but only at the mouth. I would have never thought to anneal them down any further towards the web.


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Cat_Whisperer Frequent Elocutionist Offline No 1, 9.3x74R Posts: 3877 Location: Mountains of Virginia Joined: Apr 17^th, 2004	Re: The Saga of My 25-21 Bertram Brass ... Reply #16 - Oct 17^th, 2013 at 7:00am	Print Post
	Annealing down to the web is not cool. I did that ONCE with a 300 Win Mag. Fortunately it was a Ruger #1. When I dropped the block the primer fell out. Hardness of the base is NEEDED.

	Cat Whisperer (trk) Chief of Smoke Pulaski Coehorn Works and Skunk Works Drafted May 1970, Retired Maj. U.S.Army assra #9885
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marlinguy Frequent Elocutionist Offline Ballards may be weaker, but they sure are neater! Posts: 16079 Location: Oregon Joined: Feb 2^nd, 2009	Re: The Saga of My 25-21 Bertram Brass ... Reply #17 - Oct 17^th, 2013 at 11:12am	Print Post
	Having had the same results with .25-21 Bertram brass in my Stevens 44.5, I would definitely not buy it ever again! I also annealed mine about halfway down, and still split on the first firing of a moderate load. I'm not certain full length annealing would change this, as it just seems to be junk. I have 30 some original cases that had unknown previous loadings, and I used the exact same charge on them with no splits anywhere. I'm still using these old cases years later, and still no splits. Some have gotten so worn that I could hand seat the primers, so had to peen them to tighten up the pockets, but they still don't split.

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QuestionableMaynard8130 Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 4144 Location: Benton Harbor MI Joined: Apr 17^th, 2004	Re: The Saga of My 25-21 Bertram Brass ... Reply #18 - Oct 17^th, 2013 at 12:07pm	Print Post
	I got bertram for the 9.5x46r and annealed it down as far as I could go holding cases in the bare hands, a little more than half way down the body below the long neck and shoulder. Fire formed 5 cases with starting level loads. turns out the rifle also needs a reduced and bushed firing pin and firing pin hole. lot of primer flow back. Of the 5 one split from below the shoulder to just above the web. for the 25-20ss ruger I have acquired a bunch of brass, some original UMC and a bunch of R2 brass that can be easily re-necked back up plus some of the G&H 22-3000 parent brass. In the process I also acquired about 50 previously fired older Bertram 25-20ss cases. Don't know how well they'll hold up but they appear to have been fires a couple times at least, maybe the bad ones are weeded out by now. Once I get both guns back form the 'smith I'll get a better handle on how the brass works out.

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38-55 Full Member Offline Posts: 126 Location: central pa Joined: Jul 18^th, 2004	Re: The Saga of My 25-21 Bertram Brass ... Reply #19 - Oct 17^th, 2013 at 2:24pm	Print Post
	My RCM brass has been used for a number of yrs., I have not yet lost a case, it has been shot a lot. I breach seat it, 108 gr pope style bullet, small pistol primer with AA#9 powder. Shoots very well.


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John Boy Ex Member	Re: The Saga of My 25-21 Bertram Brass ... Reply #20 - Oct 17^th, 2013 at 7:00pm	Print Post
	Cat, agree annealing to the web is not cool. IMO, it's not a smart thing to do, never have and never intend to. Anyway, the Saga is turning the corner: * FedEx picked up the Bertram cases and they are on their way back to Graf. Be interesting to hear their results of their 'testing'. * Ordered 100 cases from Rocky Mountain. Estimated delivery is the first of November And about the only decent experience of the Saga is after I got the Fecker settings figured out, here is a 100yd 5 shot group (0.8125 x 0.4688). At least it's less than MOA but I've got work to do to come close to J Lewis 300-MP targets. I'll try John (You need to *Login* or *Register* to view media files and links) Was intending to do a 200yd grouping but I'll have to do that when the RMC brass arrives
	« Last Edit: Oct 17^th, 2013 at 8:08pm by »

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screwloosetc Ex Member	Re: The Saga of My 25-21 Bertram Brass ... Reply #21 - Oct 19^th, 2013 at 12:04am	Print Post
	wasnt some one awhile back making these cases from mil223 brass?


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westerner Frequent Elocutionist Offline deleted posts and threads record holder. Posts: 11458 Location: Why, out West of course Joined: May 29^th, 2006	Re: The Saga of My 25-21 Bertram Brass ... Reply #22 - Oct 19^th, 2013 at 12:23am	Print Post
	Looks like a ten shot group to me. Joe.

	A blind squirrel runs into a tree every once in a while.
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marlinguy Frequent Elocutionist Offline Ballards may be weaker, but they sure are neater! Posts: 16079 Location: Oregon Joined: Feb 2^nd, 2009	Re: The Saga of My 25-21 Bertram Brass ... Reply #23 - Oct 19^th, 2013 at 8:26pm	Print Post
	Quote: Cat, agree annealing to the web is not cool. IMO, it's not a smart thing to do, never have and never intend to. Anyway, the Saga is turning the corner: * FedEx picked up the Bertram cases and they are on their way back to Graf. Be interesting to hear their results of their 'testing'. * Ordered 100 cases from Rocky Mountain. Estimated delivery is the first of November Hope you have better luck with Graf than I had with Buffalo Arms. BA basically told me "tough luck".

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John Boy Ex Member	Re: The Saga of My 25-21 Bertram Brass ... Reply #24 - Oct 19^th, 2013 at 8:52pm	Print Post
	Quote: Looks like a ten shot group to me. Yep, 5 shots adjusting E & W on the scope plus finally having the settings. Am sure you have had this experience too with a new reload using one target


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