So,tell me how do you know if you should compess your load or just let the bullet set on top of the wad...Will your target let you know?

And what to you find the better way to go?Full  length or just neck size? There has to be some bullet tension to hole the bullet in the case or does this not matter...

For BPCR I do not size my cases; I only neck size and bell the mouths. This way the bullet will be better centered in the throat, compared to a sized case.

Compression of black powder seems to be more important when using unpolished black powder. 

Cartridge grade powders and Swiss black powder have been polished; resulting in the angular powder corners being rounded down. Therefore polished powders compress easier. However those rough corners on unpolished powders  require some compression to compact them to the right density for more consistent velocities.

With GOEX (not the Cartridge grade) I found I had to vibrate or compress in addition to using a drop tube.

With Swiss I have been most successful just drop tubing and placing the bullet on top of the powder.

After neck sizing and belling; I tap the loaded round in the FL sizer (with the decapping rod removed) to flatten out the bell and provide full friction from the case neck without crimping.

Yes I like to leave the bell flared and use a cartridge seater to force the case into the chamber to improve centering the bullet in the lead. However you can only do this for receivers you can use a cartridge seater in the action. i.e. 1885 High Wall, 1874 Sharps or Remington Hepburn.

Also some shooting events are time restricted and you may not be able to afford the time to use a cartrdige seater. i.e trade off sight in shots in a Silhoutte match versus taking time to use a seater. Loading fixed cartrideges by themselves is much faster.

Sometimes you have to trade off a slight edge in accuracy to meet your time requirements.

Dogman,

This is one of those "ask 10 people get twelve answers" questions. 

I have some guns that do better one way than the other. In other words, the same load techniques don't apply across the board. 

In my roller (perdersoli) I drop tube 63 grains of swiss 1.5 then compress very slightly ( about a 1/16th inch iirc). If I compress more groups widen in a hurry.

I use standard neck sizing, which NORMLLY is intended for jacketed bullets of .457 neck dia. This sets me up for neck tension out of the gate as my bullets are sized to .459. But that is not all of the story. Brass, as any metal, has "spring" to it. So when neck sized down it may be smaller than .457, say, .456. Now I have a problem. That with deform the soft slugs we use and ruin any hope for accuracy.

I have bought SEVERAL expander plugs over the years. From track of the wolf and Buffalo Arms (both great places to buy from and support!) So after neck sizing I run the proper expander to give me just right about a thousandths of an inch undersize neck. This gives good tension in this gun. (my trapdoors need crimp, more because of need to build pressure to upset the base of bullet to fill notoriously oversized grooves. that is a different story tho).

Then drop tube, place .030 fiber wad then use compression plug to depth. As I seat the bullet I set the dies to take all but the smallest bit of bell out. I read somewhere that the slight bell helps some how. Perhaps it was the centering of the slug as mentioned above. I don't remember where I read it, it just seemed to work. I DID have to take my first batch back to the bench as, like an idiot, I didn't check to be sure they would chamber with the bell still present. Doh! So I had to find that setting on the seating die to get the bell almost smoothed.
I am no champion shooter. Have had some luck when I put time into it and my mind. I tinker too much. But that  gun will shoot doing all of that. All guns are different. I will shut up now.

dogman,

Unfortunately nobody can really explain what is going to work best in your rifle.  What works good in my 40-82 does not work very well in my 40-70SS, and my 45-70 takes another method to get the best load.
All of them shoot PP bullets very well.

The bottom line is start trying stuff and keep very detailed notes.  Somethings are fairly universal, for example, most folks find a good Swiss load with not much compression.   

I recommend a paper wad in the primer pocket because it seems to help all of my rifle loads, but I also shoot mostly pistol primers.  Other folks shoot just fine scores without primer wads.

Of the eight rifles I shoot [all BP] only one shoots well with minimum neck tension.  But some folks swear by the zero neck tension method.

To answer your first question about compression, start load development with minimum compression and continue adding powder to your load until you see a good group, then add a slight bit more to see if it opens up the group, then you know what you need for compression.   

With all the trigger time you will get while testing powder, primers, compression, case condition, etc, the groups will automatically start getting better. 

Keep on hav'n fun!
MikeT

Once again ,thanks to you guys I am getting information that is helping me to better understand what is going on..And I appreciate it...Maybe I am just a slow learner....
The farthist I have to shoot right now is just a tad under 300 yards...I have another place with 500 yards but if others are there,you can't do it..

And one other thing I would like to ask if it's alright...Maybe I read too damn much...I see where some guys claim to be getting their best accuracy using 1 F Goex in the 45-70 while using mag.primers..
DOES this sound right or all B.S ??????

dogman,

I am one of those that uses Fg Swiss & Goez for many different cartridges, e.g. 45-70, 40-82, & 40-70SS.  I shoot only PP bullets.  All of my rifles shoot well with pistol primers when loaded with Swiss.  Fg Goex shoot the best with BR-2 primers.  I use a primer wad under all primers no matter what.   

So to answer your question about magnum primers, I would not waste my time with them.  Magnum primers are very early, old news regarding BP cartridge reloading.
Now that is not to say that you cannot find someone still doing it or that some powder-cartridge combination may benifit from magnum primers.  I shoot 40-50BN, 40-65, 40-70SS, 40-82 Win, 40-82 Sil, 45-70, and every one shoots very well with Swiss powder & pistol primers.

Keep on hav'n fun!
MikeT

MikeT---So when are r using this 1F Goex powder,do you feel you have to use little or more compression compared to the 2F Goex powder..I have been reading Wolfs book over again and if I read it right he said that compression may not be need at all as long as there is no air space in the cartridge..Then he mention if the compression is TOO much it may be harder to ignite it and some of the charge will be blown out the bore behind the bullet..Which if one thinks about it ,it could happen...I picture something like a bottle rocket going down the barrel,,lol.........