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Sendaro
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Pan lube or lube & sizer
Jan 4th, 2012 at 3:05pm
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I'm sure that this is going to get things started! However being somewhat new to the cast bullet fun of shooting single shot rifles I'm looking for advice and want to hear your thoughts.
  I'm casting bullets & loading for a Stevens 44 in 32-40. At present the two bullet molds that I have been using are the Lyman 319247 and the SAECO 632. Have pan lubed both and have tried the Lyman 319247 lubed and sized from an old Lyman 45 with a .321 die. I can't see much difference in the accuracy attained with sized bullet over the un-sized lubed bullets. The one thing that I don't like about using the Lyman L/S is the way the lube sometimes builds up under the base of the bullet in the sizing die. Tried running the stop up and down to see if that would make a difference, but could not see much of a change in that lube build up under the bullet base in the die. As for the SAECO #632 bullet, a tapered design, I just pan lube and believe that's the way it meant to be used. Shoots just fine that way.
  My first try at making a bullet lube seems to be working just fine with smokeless powder. I used equal parts of Bees wax, Crisco, paraffin, and 3 oz of home made bear oil to come up with 3 pounds of lube. Seems to be working well, no leading of the bore, and the powder fouling cleans out easy. The only thing that concerns me a little is that it's a little soft in warm weather, and when handling the bullets to load. Think that I should cut down on the amount of Crisco and that may stiffen the lube up some.   
   Would like to hear your thoughts.  
                                         Thanks,Sendaro                   
  
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Re: Pan lube or lube & sizer
Reply #1 - Jan 4th, 2012 at 3:49pm
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You have to pan lube tapered bullets or lube them in a Pope style pump.  I find the pan faster and easier.  Pan lubing is also the way to go if you don't want to get custom lube sizer dies for each mold you own.

Having said that lube-sizers can work pretty good if they are set up right. 30's cal's with Gas Checks lube sizer is the only answer.

Trouble is they have so much pressure available you can distort a good bullet. I am going to lube about 400 .377 290 gr spritzers out of a 2 cavity base pour LBT mold in the next few days. Top punch is fitted to that particular bullet and the sizer die just barely touches the bullets side.

Bullets will be used for fixed 38/55 ammo in Club offhand matches. They are reliable loads, can be counted on to go just under 2 moa at 200 yards. Long as you want to shoot them too no small sample groups . Not good enough for bench rest ASSRA competition.   

Offhand Practice & Club match lots of rounds in a months time it's the best solution for me.

On the Lyman sizer it's critical to have the stop set right or your will get build up under the base.  Very little adjustment makes a lot of difference.  I let some lube bleed out on the nose rather than under the base. All mine need to have the noses wiped just a bit after they are loaded. 

It's different bullet to bullet too some seem to fit the sizers lube outlet better than others.  I use a 2 grove 200 gr gas checked .30 caliber Saeco mold and it never looses lube under or over the bullet.

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Re: Pan lube or lube & sizer
Reply #2 - Jan 4th, 2012 at 4:44pm
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With pan lubed bullets the lube is always harder to the touch than the same lube applied through a lube sizer or Pope lube pump.  The handling of the bullets seems to be less messy with pan lubing.  Don’t know if it prevents the lube from running during hot weather.

I think the difference in hardness is due to the breakdown of the molecular structure of the lube during the extrusion of the lube in the sizers and pumps.  In pan lubing the lube is sheared off instead of being squashed through a small orifice. 

Is the home made bear oil some concoction you came up with or is it the clear liquid that seeps out of rendered bear fat?

  

Martin Stenback
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Schuetzendave
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Re: Pan lube or lube & sizer
Reply #3 - Jan 4th, 2012 at 5:37pm
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We add roisin to the lube to make it stickier for warm weather. You can also find other waxes to add to make it stickier for warm weather. Reducing the Crisco changes the vicosity but does not assist in helping the lube stick to the bullet during very warm weather

I use a H&I die that is .001 or .002 over my barrel diameter so that I can remove any flashings and still lube the bullet without deforming the bullet in the operation. Also a bullet wider than the rifle bore helps prevent gas cutting around the bullet.

Also if you have the bullet/pin stop set too high you can compress the bullet when it bottoms out in the die. Make sure the adjustment screw does not stop the H&I die pin too early so as to prevent compression of your bullet when using a sizer.

To prevent build up of lube on my pin I drill a small hole length wise down the length of the pin. The surplus lube is pushed down through the hole instead of pushing the bullet up (which can also cause the compression of the bullet).

I have not had any problem lubing tapered bullets in either a RCBS or a Lyman sizer.

« Last Edit: Jan 4th, 2012 at 5:54pm by Schuetzendave »  
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JLouis
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Re: Pan lube or lube & sizer
Reply #4 - Jan 4th, 2012 at 11:15pm
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Pan lubing is fine and so is a lube pump it all depends how one prefers to do it. If don't like having lubed bullets left over after a match then the Dell style lube pump is the way to go. If don't mind having lubed bullets left over after a match then pan lubing is fine. 

If you have a hard time with the lube filling out the grooves when pan lubing pre-heat the bullets in the oven on low for about 10-15 minutes and problem solved.

J.Louis
  

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Schuetzendave
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Re: Pan lube or lube & sizer
Reply #5 - Jan 4th, 2012 at 11:41pm
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I lube all my bullets in the winter since there is never enough time to cast and lube in the summer.

I freeze the bullets and when I take them out they are like they were freshly lubed even if they have been in the freezer for a couple of years.

Dried hardened lube results from being left out at room temperature for a long period. They do not work as well as fresh lube on a bullet.
  
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Re: Pan lube or lube & sizer
Reply #6 - Jan 5th, 2012 at 12:55am
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When lubing each bullet in a sizer I always tape two cow magnets to the lube reservoir.  They change the molecular structure of the lube so that it last longer. I never have trouble with bore leading that way. Oh forgot to mention to lube size only on a full moon at night. 

Pan lubing works great too and thats how I lube most of my bullets. No stick metal baking pans made in China and my super secret lube formula that only Bob Tyler knows the ingredients there of, and he's not talking.   

          Hope that helps,   Joe.
  

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Sendaro
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Re: Pan lube or lube & sizer
Reply #7 - Jan 5th, 2012 at 6:37am
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The bear oil that I use is rendered down from bear fat. I have both bear grease and bear oil. The grease is just cooked longer to get the oil. The oil is clear and seemingly odorless. Have used it for several things. Even works good in cooking or baking. 
  There is just so many different lubes that are recommended that it gets hard to pick one out. Think that I may try bees wax and bear grease the next time. I have both. Anyone recommend the portions for the mix? Thanks for all the in put. Sendaro
  
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