For fast clean powder most of the action pistol shooters have gone to Hodgen Clays.  It's about the same speed as Bullseye. I am burning a bunch of it with good results in two .45acp Revolvers.

Will be loading up some gallery sub sonic 32/40's for this winters indoor 50 ' matches.  These loads are one class more powerful than the Zimmers at about 1000 fps with a 125 gr .322 bullet.

If I can get the right round ball will give some 600-700 foot zimmerstyle loads to try same time.

10 M Air rifles rested easily clean the 50' ASSRA center even at the longer distance. 22's do the same. Squib 32/40's have to work hard to shoot groups tight enough to keep them all in the 25/center.  I have never been able to shoot scores as high squib 32 as I have .22 rimfire same target same rifle same match.  Scoring is different center of the hole instead of leaded edge which is a disadvantage but don't think the squibs are nearly as consistent as rimfires.  Some tight but always some flyer's

Boats

Round Ball Zimmer Loads 

I've been messing around shooting some round balls (0.330"- actually OO shot) from my CPA 32-40 barrel.   The results are sort of mixed but interesting non the less.   I only have some Win 231 powder so I used that per suggetions.   I tried 1 gr and the group size was rather large, maybe 5/8 " at my very short (20 ft) basement range.   Just for testing mind you .  The powder is dirty as warned; got to buy come Clays or Bullseye.   

I increased the load to 1.5 gr and the group tightened up considerabley...all of the shots in maybe a .35 or .40 hole.   For reference I shot my old Marlin 39A with CB shorts from the same 2x4 across the doorway rest and the group with open sights was almost one hole...maybe 0.3".  That rifle is a shooter! 

I tried breech seating a ball and the results were interesting.  I knocked a seated ball from the breech and it came out with a nice ring of lead...just like my 44 cal BP revolver.  I shot a breech seated ball and the first time it didn't make it half way down the barrel (1 gr powder).  At least I recovered the ball and it has a nice cylindrical area with clear rifling grooves.    I shot a couple breech seated and then backed off.  No reason to breech seat and I think the free bore to the rifling helps.   

I don't know why I'm doing this...the balls, powder and primers are around 8 cents per round. I can buy 22 CB short of longs for about the same cost...but it is fun.  The problem with the round balls at close range is scoring...one really has to shoot one bull per bullet.   

BTW - the round balls pack some whallop.  I recovered a few balls from the trap and they are half cut away or sheared off.  I shot one into a 2x4 and it went in 2 inches and was more or less undamaged.   

next I will chrony the loads and see where this gets me.   

A couple of photos follow and they are more or less self explanatory.  The single round ball is the one recovered from the 2x4.   

David

Frank,

Yep, it is the shot.  I had to by 5 pounds of OO shot (Hornaday) for $28 and it contains 660 balls so the cost per ball is 4.2 cents...kind of pricy.   

When I get time I will chronograph a series of loads and get the velocity vs charge curve.   

David

Well, we had our end of the year match and get together and shot the Zimmers. We shot on the ISSA Zimmer target. There were two real Zimmers and my improvised one.

Tony, our host had grouped his Zimmer and showed me the target. I measured it with my tape measure and it was right at 5/8 for 10 shots. So, right now mine is about 70% as accurated as his real Zimmer. I also learned that shooting a Zimmer isn't cheap. He just resupplied himself with new ammo and it now costs 30 cents a shot. So, that gives even more reason to explore this.

I let everyone shoot mine and all enjoyed it. The third thing that I learned was, that my balls WILL NOT go through the 1" plywood back stop that we were using at 50 ft.

Something that has occurred to me is that we could have winter Zimmerstutzen matches at the local indoor pistol ranges and develop some rules for it.

I know that ISSA has some sort of a Zimmer class but, I have no idea what there (or any ones else's) rules are including the range that they shoot or even what constitutes a Zimmerstutzen.

One last thought is, since the Zimmer calibers run from about 4mm to 5mm, that you could build a rifle on a 17 or 20 cal barrel and use a 22 rf case or a shortened and necked Hornet case for it.

Biggi, are there any European rules as to what makes a rifle a Zimmerstutzen?

Frank

How about machining a 5" section of 17 cal barrel (1/2" liner) to the case dimensions with the remaining part turned to bore diameter or a little smaller with some heat shrink tubing over it to protect the bore and make a nice slip fit. Bore the "case" for large rifle primers or shotgun primers and place the ball, just ahead of the primer in it's own little seat. 

Shoot, extract normally, pull the insert, push the primer out with a rod, insert a ball and primer, rechamber and shoot again. I think a primer of either type could power the ball well. If not, bore a little deeper for some powder.

You don't have to be fancy about making the "case" fit. It could just be neck diameter back to near the rim, then a short section at case head size lastly, head space the rim well. It should go in and out very easy that way.

Frank

frnkeore wrote on Oct 26^th, 2011 at 1:49am:


Thats what I did about ten years ago Frank. I use a shotgun primer. Turned a .17 Anschuts barrel down to .316? left a rim. Also added a brass tube to it so it doesnt foul my barrel. I think Rob Rez did one too.   
I use regular lead Zimmer balls.  Shoots good out to 50 feet.  Not legal in Zimmerstutzen matches, but makes for excellent OH practice.

             Joe. 

Cant remember who I was talking to Frank.  The rifle I use it in is a Win Helm.  

I think it should be legal because zimmerstutzen adapters were made in the old days.  There was one on ebay or somewhere a while back.  

They made a lot of adapters in the old days. I saw a factory made .22 adapter for a 98 Mauser at a gun show once.  It replaced the original bolt and had a long barrel that went into the rifles bore. 

From a technical standpoint, I dont think your setup could be called a zimmerstuzen because you're using gun powder.  

            Joe.  

Cool! Didnt know anyone was making  adapters. Thanks Mike!


          Joe.