I thought I'd move the OH talk over here, to were it should be.

I don't know how many on this forum know or have even heard the name, Jim Feren since, it's been 16 years since he has shot in the ASSRA and 24 years since he first broke Hudsons record, made in 1903. Hudson only broke 2300 one time and from that time until those original 100 shot matches ended in 1927 No one else got above 2283.

Between his first year shooting it in '87 and the last year that I know of in '95, He won the 100 shot match seven times out of nine years. He was 3rd once and didn't shoot in'94. He broke Hudsons record 5 times and still holds the record (2341-24c) as well as the Metro record (1184-13c), he shot the high single target score of 241-5c in '93 also and the only other person in those years to break Hudson's 2301 was Jim Luke with a excellent 2320. Only two other people won the 100 shot match seven times and that was C.T. Westergaard. His highest winning score was 2253 in 1922. F.C. Ross also won seven times with irons, his highest winning score was 2238 shot in 1901.

So, you can see how remarkable it is to shoot well offhand and at the rate that things have been going, I can't see how Ferens record can come close to being broken.

Hudson, to his credit did not opt to use a scope in that year of 1903, the first that scopes were allowed. So, I guess you could say that he still holds the iron sight record as no one that I know of has shot it with iron sights since 1986, it's first year back.

Unless there has been a 2300 shot since 1997, ONLY Hudson, Luke and Feren have a 2300+ from 1893 when it started, to date.

Since he is the best Schuetzen shooter of ALL time (to date), I believe that ASSRA should recognize him in some significant way and invite and promote others to break that record.

What say you?

Frank

Quite the idea, Frank. But consider why do we have 2 organizations (ISSA & ASSRA) to govern a sport that is wheeeeezing along with little new blood coming into it. I did not count the WSU as I think it is a local thing at best. The influx of newbies is not overwhelming anyone.
if you dont have your battery of guns for the sport and the myriad tons of expensive equipment to support them ,you are probably not going to get them. it must be daunting to go to a match with a H&R Handigun and have to compete with custon rifles costing thousands. On top of that, part of the match is offhand for which we have very little training. In 1893 boys and men knew and used their rifles as tools and could shoot them. the military trains the average recruit to spray and pray so we dont have that source of shooters anymore.
local and regional matches should stress offhand as a discipline.few do.
i like the idea you have. we need to honor those who have gone before and set the bar for us to strive for.

Interesting read. 

Frank - can you tell us a bit about the guns and cartridges that were used to break 2300? 

I gave up golf as I could never find a set of clubs that was good enough to allow me to shoot par, or better. Hope it doesn't turn out the same way with my single-shot rifles.  

Ditto everything  SSShooter said.  I have not missed my golf clubs since I shot my first match.    Sounds like a great challenge.   

-06

Rules were different in Hudsons day.   Generally shoot in turn on demand all shots count.  For very good reasons ASSRA counts holes on paper not shots fired and gives you the entire Schuetzen match to shoot your 10 targets.  At the top level all shots fired counting is not real important Best shooters are not missing the paper, however ability to pick conditions is a real advantage. Having said that if any number of competitors in other shooting sports focused on the Hudson match have no doubt Dr Hudsons record could be broken under the rules he fired his record. Jim Feren came from Silhouette and I believe went back to it after his Schuetzen shooting

If you want to shoot offhand with old rifles and lots of competition get a Lever action or shoot local club matches not under ASSRA rules.  Our club has regular turn out twice a month averaging 2 dozen shooters for offhand gong matches single shot or lever plain base cast  bullet.   We don't shoot formal Schuetzen due to lack of benches for rest shooting and requirement to tie the range up for 2 or 3 days.

I may get up some offhand matches on the ASSRA 200 yard target as a side to our club matches at some point.  Would have to be squadded relays shoulder to shoulder all shots count no sighters after the sighting period.  Thinking 50 shots for cash prizes.  That would bring out our regular match shooters,  introduce them to the ASSRA target and fit available range time. Think the scores would suprise  you. Some of these boys can shoot. Next month am up in Pennsylvania for the CLA state match, bet there are 100 plus shooters on the line including several former Schuetzen shooters.   

I got into the sport to move up a level in offhand competition. Thing about Silhouette is it's easy to accept misses which only count one target you are not going to hit them all anyway, while Schuetzen every shot counts and misses carry a severe penalty. There is no doubt Schuetzen has improved my Silhouette performance.

Boats

I had the privilege of spotting for Jim Faren about 10 or 12 years ago at the California State High Power Silhouette Championship Match at Coalinga.  I did not know who he was at the time but he sure could shoot.  I have not seen him since but about that time I switched from smokeless Silhouette to BPCR Silhouette.

From Boats:  "Rules were different in Hudsons day.   Generally shoot in turn on demand all shots count.  For very good reasons ASSRA counts holes on paper not shots fired and gives you the entire Schuetzen match to shoot your 10 targets.  At the top level all shots fired counting is not real important Best shooters are not missing the paper, however ability to pick conditions is a real advantage. "

Other differences: Rings went out to 1.  There were no wind flags. 

On approaching the window the schiessen had 3 minutes to get his shot off, which was then scored and the schiessen retreated back to a table off the line to reload and commiserate with his fellows, while someone else took a shot.  In some ways this could be an advantage, as a more relaxing way of shooting.

Of course you can, Joe. Just because your a ASSRA member, you don't have to shot it (but, I bet you will ). What I'm hoping to do is get a interest going that will keep these guns alive. I don't want it to be shot with AR's And AK's. 

I started this when I was 40 In 1985. I was a "kid" then but, we need people to get interested in this at 20 something both to raise the scores (not really possible in BR now) and to stir interest among there friends. It benefits us all to have younger blood. More demand for our guns and more prestige for for them and what they can do. Us old cogers will still be shooting until we pass but, we have to pass it on to someone. I always fear that these gun will die off and be lost forever.

Before the 1960's boys grew up wanting to shoot (I did) and go hunting now a lot just want instant gratification and want to party. It would even be good for society to some extent. YA, I'm out to save the world   

Frank