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bullet squaring tool (Read 20342 times)

frnkeore Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 7249 Location: Central Point, OR 97502 Joined: Jun 16^th, 2010	Re: bullet squaring tool Reply #30 - Aug 23^rd, 2011 at 1:51pm	Print Post
	If your sprue plate is warped, what you do is make up some plaster of paris and put it between the plate and chuck before you turn it on then let it dry, turn the chuck on and your good to go. That way the chuck can't pull it out of shape. Some commercial places use sulphur on non magnetic materials but, for myself, I can't stand the smell. Frank

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BP Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 8039 Location: Westside Joined: Aug 27^th, 2006	Re: bullet squaring tool Reply #31 - Aug 23^rd, 2011 at 2:57pm	Print Post
	Quote: I am left handed so the glove doesn't work. joe b, I know a left-handed caster who uses a glove. He just screws the mould blocks to the handles 180 out from normal, and then pulls the sprue plate toward and across the hinge of the handles. Works for him anyway.

	There are three kinds of men: The ones that learn by reading, the few who learn by observation, and the rest who have to pee on the electric fence and find out for themselves. Proud Noodlehead
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westerner Frequent Elocutionist Offline deleted posts and threads record holder. Posts: 11434 Location: Why, out West of course Joined: May 29^th, 2006	Re: bullet squaring tool Reply #32 - Aug 23^rd, 2011 at 5:50pm	Print Post
	frnkeore wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2011 at 1:51pm: If your sprue plate is warped, what you do is make up some plaster of paris and put it between the plate and chuck before you turn it on then let it dry, turn the chuck on and your good to go. That way the chuck can't pull it out of shape. Some commercial places use sulphur on non magnetic materials but, for myself, I can't stand the smell. Frank Or you could hit it with a hammer. Think I know someone besides me that would do that. Joe.

	A blind squirrel runs into a tree every once in a while.
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westerner Frequent Elocutionist Offline deleted posts and threads record holder. Posts: 11434 Location: Why, out West of course Joined: May 29^th, 2006	Re: bullet squaring tool Reply #33 - Aug 23^rd, 2011 at 6:01pm	Print Post
	Cat_Whisperer wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2011 at 10:05am: Valid concern. If I grind the magnetic chuck first to clean it up then it should be 'flat'. (ASSUMING the flip-side of the spue cutter plate is 'flat'.) Lapping is STILL a good idea. Measuring on the CMM will be the final test of flatness. Perhaps also grinding the top of the mould? The only way I know to do this correctly, is to mount the mold in a dividing head. Check cavity run out, then grind. Easiest way for me. Joe.

	A blind squirrel runs into a tree every once in a while.
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Cat_Whisperer Frequent Elocutionist Offline No 1, 9.3x74R Posts: 3873 Location: Mountains of Virginia Joined: Apr 17^th, 2004	Re: bullet squaring tool Reply #34 - Aug 23^rd, 2011 at 8:52pm	Print Post
	If one were to use a surface grinder, it could be held in the magnetic chuck and indicated in. Then the grining would be parallel to the existing top surface (which one would ASSUME to be perpendicular to the axis of each cavity. Lathe of course would also work - and be a bit more conventional in approach.

	Cat Whisperer (trk) Chief of Smoke Pulaski Coehorn Works and Skunk Works Drafted May 1970, Retired Maj. U.S.Army assra #9885
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Cat_Whisperer Frequent Elocutionist Offline No 1, 9.3x74R Posts: 3873 Location: Mountains of Virginia Joined: Apr 17^th, 2004	Re: bullet squaring tool Reply #35 - Aug 23^rd, 2011 at 8:58pm	Print Post
	OK. I've dug out 6 new two cavity and 6 one cavity (I assume Lyman) sprue cutter plates. Will check at work how flat they are with a cmm.

	Cat Whisperer (trk) Chief of Smoke Pulaski Coehorn Works and Skunk Works Drafted May 1970, Retired Maj. U.S.Army assra #9885
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Cat_Whisperer Frequent Elocutionist Offline No 1, 9.3x74R Posts: 3873 Location: Mountains of Virginia Joined: Apr 17^th, 2004	Re: bullet squaring tool Reply #36 - Aug 23^rd, 2011 at 9:00pm	Print Post
	frnkeore wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2011 at 1:51pm: If your sprue plate is warped, what you do is make up some plaster of paris and put it between the plate and chuck before you turn it on then let it dry, turn the chuck on and your good to go. That way the chuck can't pull it out of shape. Some commercial places use sulphur on non magnetic materials but, for myself, I can't stand the smell. Frank Thanks, Frank! Ideas like this make these forums PRICELESS!

	Cat Whisperer (trk) Chief of Smoke Pulaski Coehorn Works and Skunk Works Drafted May 1970, Retired Maj. U.S.Army assra #9885
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JLouis Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 10625 Joined: Apr 8^th, 2009	Re: bullet squaring tool Reply #37 - Aug 23^rd, 2011 at 9:20pm	Print Post
	Assuming one does not have a surface grinder which would be typical and one does not have a lathe which would be typical then one needs to listen to what 40 Rod had to say in his post. Don't surface grind the sprue plate, lap it out. The magnetic chuck on the grinder can pull out a slight warp, you grind it flat then release the chuck and the warp springs back. Use some old glass and some lapping compound. 40 Rod I have used this process of which eliminates all of the assumptions and does not require purchasing the above mentioned equipment and it works so why try to make it more complicated than it really is for the new guys and gals who are entering into this sport? J.Louis
	« Last Edit: Aug 24^th, 2011 at 11:44am by JLouis »
	" It Is Better To Now Have Been A Has Been Than A Never Was Or A Wanna Be "
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Cat_Whisperer Frequent Elocutionist Offline No 1, 9.3x74R Posts: 3873 Location: Mountains of Virginia Joined: Apr 17^th, 2004	Re: bullet squaring tool Reply #38 - Aug 23^rd, 2011 at 10:08pm	Print Post
	There are a few of us that have the equipment. I will use it, and other equipment at work (CMM) to learn some basic principles about which we are postulating now. First, the measurement of NEW Lyman sprue cutting plates - who knows? They MAY be flat over the entire surface within 0.001" tolerance zone. But does anyone KNOW? Second, lets say they ARE flat within a tol. zone of 0.001". Will smoothing OR making more flat make ANY difference? THEN comes the hammering the sprue plate - will it make any difference. Sure, lapping is OK. Do it if you have to. Do it if you want to. I'm going to learn SOMETHING from the processes I choose - which may well include a comparison between original and surface ground and lapped plates. And, thanks for the further exploration here. Re-reading your post, it's come to mind to MEASURE to see if there is/will be any affect of warping the steel plates. Tune in tomorrow - well - many tomorrows - I still need to MOVE and install the surface grinder.

	Cat Whisperer (trk) Chief of Smoke Pulaski Coehorn Works and Skunk Works Drafted May 1970, Retired Maj. U.S.Army assra #9885
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westerner Frequent Elocutionist Offline deleted posts and threads record holder. Posts: 11434 Location: Why, out West of course Joined: May 29^th, 2006	Re: bullet squaring tool Reply #39 - Aug 23^rd, 2011 at 10:22pm	Print Post
	JLouis wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2011 at 9:20pm: Assuming one does not have a surface grinder which would be typical and one does not have a lathe which would be typical then one needs to listen to what 40 Rod had to say in his post. Don't surface grind the sprue plate, lap it out. The magnetic chuck on the grinder can pull out a slight warp, you grind it flat then release the chuck and the warp springs back. Use some old glass and some lapping compound. 40 Rod I have used this process of which eliminates all of the assumptions and does not require purchasing the above mentioned equipment and it works so why try to make it more complicated than it really is to the new guys and gals who are trying to enter into this sport? J.Louis I dont know what sort of magnetic table you have, John. It must be extremely POWERFUL! I can pull a sprue plate off my magnetic table with my fingers. I lap my sprue plates with a piece of sandpaper on the bench, unless they're galled up.. Doesnt have to be absolutely perfect as long as the burrs are off and it's flat. Joe.

	A blind squirrel runs into a tree every once in a while.
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Cat_Whisperer Frequent Elocutionist Offline No 1, 9.3x74R Posts: 3873 Location: Mountains of Virginia Joined: Apr 17^th, 2004	Re: bullet squaring tool Reply #40 - Aug 23^rd, 2011 at 10:24pm	Print Post
	How flat is flat? Does it really make a difference? How MUCH difference is caused by how much out of flattness?

	Cat Whisperer (trk) Chief of Smoke Pulaski Coehorn Works and Skunk Works Drafted May 1970, Retired Maj. U.S.Army assra #9885
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BP Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 8039 Location: Westside Joined: Aug 27^th, 2006	Re: bullet squaring tool Reply #41 - Aug 23^rd, 2011 at 11:09pm	Print Post
	Cat_Whisperer, Just following your questioning.... regardless of whether the sprue plates are from either old or new manufacture mould blocks, it would seem that a dial indicator could be quickly run across the bottom surface (the side toward the mould) to see just how flat they may or may not really be.

	There are three kinds of men: The ones that learn by reading, the few who learn by observation, and the rest who have to pee on the electric fence and find out for themselves. Proud Noodlehead
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westerner Frequent Elocutionist Offline deleted posts and threads record holder. Posts: 11434 Location: Why, out West of course Joined: May 29^th, 2006	Re: bullet squaring tool Reply #42 - Aug 23^rd, 2011 at 11:35pm	Print Post
	Cat_Whisperer wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2011 at 8:52pm: If one were to use a surface grinder, it could be held in the magnetic chuck and indicated in. Then the grining would be parallel to the existing top surface (which one would ASSUME to be perpendicular to the axis of each cavity. Lathe of course would also work - and be a bit more conventional in approach. Yep thats perty close. You do know what happens when you assume something, right? I guy named Murphy shows up and and makes an a_ _ out of you and me, and he's got the law on his side! I think we got way off topic here but it sure has been fun. Bullet base trimmers? Joe.

	A blind squirrel runs into a tree every once in a while.
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gunlaker Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 2257 Location: lower mainland, B.C. Joined: Dec 13^th, 2010	Re: bullet squaring tool Reply #43 - Aug 24^th, 2011 at 1:15am	Print Post
	BP wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2011 at 2:57pm: Quote: I am left handed so the glove doesn't work. joe b, I know a left-handed caster who uses a glove. He just screws the mould blocks to the handles 180 out from normal, and then pulls the sprue plate toward and across the hinge of the handles. Works for him anyway. I'm a lefty and I also use a glove. Works fine for me. I used to use a piece of hardwood until I found that a glove works just fine. Chris.


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Cat_Whisperer Frequent Elocutionist Offline No 1, 9.3x74R Posts: 3873 Location: Mountains of Virginia Joined: Apr 17^th, 2004	Re: bullet squaring tool Reply #44 - Aug 24^th, 2011 at 8:26am	Print Post
	We'll have some numbers from the cmm today. Running a dial indicator back and forth assumes both surfaces are parallel, unless you dial it in. I'm guessing that flatness will be about 0.001" tolerance zone. (Hence my question of whether or not making it flatter will matter.) Taking double sided tape and putting fine grit sand paper on the surface plate and LIGHTLY lapping the sprue plate will show high and low spots. Of course there may be other advantages to lapping - making the suface smoother to lessen the ability of the alloy sticking to it.

	Cat Whisperer (trk) Chief of Smoke Pulaski Coehorn Works and Skunk Works Drafted May 1970, Retired Maj. U.S.Army assra #9885
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