ASSRA Forum - Is it time for a change?

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Is it time for a change? (Read 32337 times)

BP Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 8039 Location: Westside Joined: Aug 27^th, 2006	Is it time for a change? Aug 10^th, 2011 at 1:11am	Print Post
	To the membership, First, let me say that we all owe Jim and Josh Borton a great debt of gratitude for the time, effort and hard work that they have unselfishly put into the creation and continued maintenance of this web site for all our benefit. The forum rules they have established are, in my opinion, easy to comply with and have generally served us well. My hat is off to these two gentleman, and they both have my inadequate and humble thanks. Now to topic - We've all read the posts by J Louis lately indicating that we forum members have lost our way, that the forum as we currently utilize it is not what it was intended for, and that those of us who are not charter members and not complying with the forum's original intent should consider separating ourselves from this forum to start a new one, etc.... In all fairness to John Louis, I believe he should be given the opportunity to explain *exactly* what he believes this forum is and is not intended for, and to *enumerate* the set of rules he believes are required to bring this forum into proper alignment with its original intent. After having heard John out, we can conduct a poll among the ASSRA *membership* to determine if John's requirements for re-alignment should be considered for adoption... providing that charter members Jim and Josh Borton concur with the proposed changes, as the workload would fall upon them. How about it John Louis... what *exact* format would your *properly* re-aligned forum take? Specific details will, of course, be necessary for proper understanding and consideration by both newer and older members alike. John, please let us know. My sincere regards to one and all, BP
	« Last Edit: Aug 10^th, 2011 at 4:32am by BP »
	There are three kinds of men: The ones that learn by reading, the few who learn by observation, and the rest who have to pee on the electric fence and find out for themselves. Proud Noodlehead
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slumlord44 Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 2849 Location: Lebanon, Illinois 62254 Joined: Dec 21^st, 2007	Re: Is it time for a change? Reply #1 - Aug 10^th, 2011 at 1:47am	Print Post
	As a paid member I would also like to see this. I personaly like the website the way it is. Petty bickering and name calling I can do without. I can see all ot that over on the Gunbroker forums.


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tim_s Oldtimer Offline Posts: 815 Location: 13066 Joined: Oct 11^th, 2006	Re: Is it time for a change? Reply #2 - Aug 10^th, 2011 at 10:40am	Print Post
	Folks, I have been more of a casual participant in this forum, being a bit of a collector/shooter but a serious competitor in other rifle disciplines and forums. It has been my experience that the very nature of public forums suggests that some elements are always somewhat in a state of flux, somebody is always concerned/upset/ frustrated with SOMETHING. Human nature, after all has'nt changed in recent years and the anonymous nature of most forum posting probably dose'nt help. Once you begin to make changes based on a variety of influences the decent down the rabbit hole commences. This forum seems to honestly be made up of more fact based participants, generally polite, usually informative, than most I've seen. Perfect? No...what is.

	“ I don’t have to be faster than the bear, I just have to be faster than you”
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Dave Ex Member	Re: Is it time for a change? Reply #3 - Aug 10^th, 2011 at 10:40am	Print Post
	I don't know John very well, I have only met him face to face once. That said he has helped me greatly in my efforts to get going in this sport and I appreciate that greatly. His scores say more than words can about his ability. The way he treats a newcomer speaks loads to his character. Everyone is entitled to an opinion. No one should be put down for expressing an opinion they arrived at in good faith. Inflammatory discussions do only harm. The proper way to get real change is to send a private message to a board member and he can raise the matter with the board and see if the idea gains traction. Every time we have one of these blow ups we drive people away and we hurt the organization as a whole. If we keep this up those that keep this sight going may just get too disgusted to keep the effort going and that would be a real loss.


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Set_Trigger Ex Member	Re: Is it time for a change? Reply #4 - Aug 10^th, 2011 at 10:44am	Print Post
	Hi BP, As a paid member I would also like to hear something constructive from John, not just the typical stuff, something constructive that would benefit all ASSRA members. I wish John would set down and study the ASSRA Constitution, not just read it, study it. Then let us know how he would like to see things done.. S T.


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Dave Ex Member	Re: Is it time for a change? Reply #5 - Aug 10^th, 2011 at 12:06pm	Print Post
	Set Trigger, my comment was not meant to be directed toward John. Please reread your last post and ask yourself if you would like such a post directed to yourself. It was more than a bit over he top.


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JLouis Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 10625 Joined: Apr 8^th, 2009	Re: Is it time for a change? Reply #6 - Aug 10^th, 2011 at 12:31pm	Print Post
	BP your request to me is not for me to answer alone it would need to be addressed by all of the original individuals who were instrumental in the creation of this site and the reasons for doing so. I am not sure at this point in time if they would like to provide a response but I would urge you to redirect your question to include all of them. J.Louis

	" It Is Better To Now Have Been A Has Been Than A Never Was Or A Wanna Be "
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Cat_Whisperer Frequent Elocutionist Offline No 1, 9.3x74R Posts: 3872 Location: Mountains of Virginia Joined: Apr 17^th, 2004	Re: Is it time for a change? Reply #7 - Aug 10^th, 2011 at 12:57pm	Print Post
	It is always time for a change. But change is more likely to occur if called for by those in the power postitions. I see some change, not as much as I want, but it's positive. What needs to be changed? I'll note but one item - this website would be better if it were updated at least annually. I'll know when that is about to happen when the powers that be either update it or - or - ask for input on how to improve it - or - ask for volunteers to help do it.

	Cat Whisperer (trk) Chief of Smoke Pulaski Coehorn Works and Skunk Works Drafted May 1970, Retired Maj. U.S.Army assra #9885
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JLouis Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 10625 Joined: Apr 8^th, 2009	Re: Is it time for a change? Reply #8 - Aug 10^th, 2011 at 1:05pm	Print Post
	Queston As a paid member I would also like to hear something constructive from John, not just the typical stuff, something constructive that would benefit all ASSRA members. I wish John would set down and study the ASSRA Constitution, not just read it, study it. Answer Set_Trigger go back and review my testing with the new 300MP powder in both the 32-40 and 38-55 and please let me know if you found that to be constructive and to the benefit of all the ASSRA Members and I must add none members alike and if you think that fits within the parameters of the ASSRA Constitution. J.Louis
	« Last Edit: Aug 10^th, 2011 at 1:12pm by JLouis »
	" It Is Better To Now Have Been A Has Been Than A Never Was Or A Wanna Be "
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Set_Trigger Ex Member	Re: Is it time for a change? Reply #9 - Aug 10^th, 2011 at 1:22pm	Print Post
	Quote: Set Trigger, my comment was not meant to be directed toward John. Please reread your last post and ask yourself if you would like such a post directed to yourself. It was more than a bit over he top. Dave, Please re-read who my last comment was directed to, it was to BP about "change", this is what he asked John: "In all fairness to John Louis, I believe he should be given the opportunity to explain exactly what he believes this forum is and is not intended for, and to enumerate the set of rules he believes are required to bring this forum into proper alignment with its original intent". I'm not the one complaining about the content of the different sections of the forum. I think it's just fine the way it is. John does not seem to think so. All I asked was that John study the ASSRA Constitution and then like BP said get back to the members with his ideas. If the forum is not being run the way it was intended then it should get back on tract, if it needs to be up dated that should be talked about. Please re-read BP's comments to John about change, that should clear things up. My belief is that I think ASSRA as a single shot Association should be interested in all aspects of single shot rifles, shooting, collecting, re-loading, etc., etc. Bottom line, there should be room for all of us, not just the shooters like John. If that was not the intent of the ASSRA and this forum then I'm in the wrong place. If that's so let me know and I'll leave. I'm sure that will make some happy. S T.


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Set_Trigger Ex Member	Re: Is it time for a change? Reply #10 - Aug 10^th, 2011 at 1:53pm	Print Post
	Hi John, That was a very informative, constructive, and I'm sure a benefit to all the ASSRA Members that had an interest in shooting the 32-40 and the 38-55. I know it was useful to me when working with my 32-40, it gave me a lot of different things to try and I thank you for it. But as I'm sure you know that's not what this debate is all about. It's about you stating that the intent of this forum is not what the founders had in mind when it was set up. Was there a G D section, a buy, sell, trade section, etc. any other sections besides a shooting section ?. All I have to go by is what is in the Constitution. I wasn't around when the forum was set up so I don't really know what the real intent was, again I can only go by the ASSRA Constitution, if the intent is different than what is in the Constitution I'm sure a lot of members would like to hear about it. If the intent was for shooters only so be it, if changes need to be made lets hear about them. S T.


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BP Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 8039 Location: Westside Joined: Aug 27^th, 2006	Re: Is it time for a change? Reply #11 - Aug 10^th, 2011 at 2:30pm	Print Post
	Quote: BP your request to me is not for me to answer alone it would need to be addressed by all of the original individuals who were instrumental in the creation of this site and the reasons for doing so. John Louis, Of course all of the original charter members should provide their input, if and when they see fit to do so. However, none of the other charter members have yet done so, and as you say, at this time they may not wish to provide a response. As one of the original charter members, you were present during the formation of the forum, and are therefore in a unique position to understand its original intent and the deviations this forum in its current format has taken from it. You appear to be the only charter member willing to provide the information to the membership for our proper understanding and consideration of the issues you have raised. Will you do so? Respectfully, BP
	« Last Edit: Aug 10^th, 2011 at 2:45pm by BP »
	There are three kinds of men: The ones that learn by reading, the few who learn by observation, and the rest who have to pee on the electric fence and find out for themselves. Proud Noodlehead
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JLouis Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 10625 Joined: Apr 8^th, 2009	Re: Is it time for a change? Reply #12 - Aug 10^th, 2011 at 3:15pm	Print Post
	BP this topic was just started today and it surely will not conclude today so please provide the original charter members the time and opportunity to choose to respond or not to respond. J.Louis

	" It Is Better To Now Have Been A Has Been Than A Never Was Or A Wanna Be "
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Dave Ex Member	Re: Is it time for a change? Reply #13 - Aug 10^th, 2011 at 3:46pm	Print Post
	I really don't care who a comment is directed to if it is derogatory to another member it is not appropriate. If you can't say something nice don't say it at all or use the PM function, of course safety is an exception. Every time this sort of petty bickering comes up posting goes down and we degrade the site and organization. Personally I like a spirited discussion of varying ideas but when the discussion crosses the line to meanness and personal attacks we should all have enough common sense to end the discussion.


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boats Frequent Elocutionist Offline Posts: 7538 Location: Virginia Joined: Apr 23^rd, 2004	Re: Is it time for a change? Reply #14 - Aug 10^th, 2011 at 4:42pm	Print Post
	Believe I am a charter forum member and have no advice to give or comment to make. Boats


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