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creedmoormatch
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External Ballistics
May 13th, 2011 at 11:27am
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   Question concerning External Ballistics :

   I am interested in knowing what influence upon a cast lead projectile (bullet) will be experience by virtue of the bullet transitioning from a higher rate of speed down to a subsonic rate of speed ?

   That is, other than the obvious fact that the bullet is moving slower at the subsonic speed.  Wink     Wink

   Creedmoormatch
  
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KWK
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Re: External Ballistics
Reply #1 - May 13th, 2011 at 11:59am
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The drag will be lower.  However, I recall the transition through sonic can be less than symmetrical and so might induce some wobble.
  

Karl
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frnkeore
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Re: External Ballistics
Reply #2 - May 13th, 2011 at 1:27pm
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Webb,
Go to the library and check out a book on aerodynamics and read the section on transonic flight. It's very interesting. Or do research online regarding the subject.

Frank
  

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creedmoormatch
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Re: External Ballistics
Reply #3 - May 14th, 2011 at 6:44am
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   Actually, Frank, my brother-in-law has his Masters degree in aeronautical engineering and is in the U.S. Senior Executive Service.  He works in the Pentagon and is on the Chief of Staff for R & D.  Accordingly, I have a resource there at my disposal that the U.S. pays big dollars to access.

   Aeronautical components of aircraft flight are much advanced over what I want or need to know about a 200 Grain lead bullet going to subsonic speed.

  I'll just settle for the "it goes wobble" information for the time being.

   Creedmoormatch
  
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Re: External Ballistics
Reply #4 - May 14th, 2011 at 7:06am
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Quote:

  Question concerning External Ballistics :

  I am interested in knowing what influence upon a cast lead projectile (bullet) will be experience by virtue of the bullet transitioning from a higher rate of speed down to a subsonic rate of speed ?

  That is, other than the obvious fact that the bullet is moving slower at the subsonic speed.  Wink     Wink

  Creedmoormatch


Dr. Mann addressed this issue in the 1920's.  His observation was that after the transition the bullets settled down and resumed a smaller grouping that during the transition.

It would be very interesting to have multiple computer traces of the wobble - to track the paths of a dozen bullets to know the shape of the deviation from the 'normal' path - to know how high/wide and how long; and a comparison of group size just before and after the 'wobble'.

One could then plan the location of the transitional wobble to be after the target or sufficiently before it to maintain sufficiently small group size.
  

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Re: External Ballistics
Reply #5 - May 14th, 2011 at 7:07am
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If one had access to good computer modeling, it would also be interesting to see the effects of bulelt shape and the resultant variations in the different wobble paths.
  

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creedmoormatch
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Re: External Ballistics
Reply #6 - May 14th, 2011 at 7:24am
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  Tim :

  I do own a copy of Dr. Franklin Mann's work on ballistics and I'll have to go back and refresh myself on what his conclusions were on this subject.

  I agree with you that a computer model would tell one at what point (distance) the bullet would wobble and thereby allow one to keep that distance beyond the target distance.

   Creedmoormatch
  
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Re: External Ballistics
Reply #7 - May 14th, 2011 at 11:18am
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Here is a link to an interesting article (You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)
The old wasp-waist bullets were designed to thwart the effects of transitional velocities.  I think NEI might still make a mold for these bullets. I'm not sure.  Back in the 70's Herters offered the wasp-waist for long range shooting and they proved their worth keeping accurate hits after going sonic.  The problem with the bullet is in the seating since it is hard to align the bullet in the case properly and there is little room to adjust the depth with the cast bullet.  It would be interesting to toy around with the bullet design some just to see what it can do.  The above link is very interesting to read and the photo's help to explain the design.  
  
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