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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Members of the ASSRA and selling on this forum (Read 51002 times)
Andy
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Re: Members of the ASSRA and selling on this forum
Reply #15 - Feb 16th, 2011 at 11:26pm
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My only benefit from being a member is the newsletter, so I would hope that a sales tax would improve the newsletter.

How about this: rifle for sale, x dollars member pays ASSRA tax. It will happen.

Maybe we don't have a "for sale" on the forum but keep it all for print in the newsletter. 

I have bought rifles, sights, a mold, and a barrel here, check "for sale" a couple times a day.

Andy
  
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QuestionableMaynard8130
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Re: Members of the ASSRA and selling on this forum
Reply #16 - Feb 16th, 2011 at 11:32pm
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At this point I have uncertain mixed feelings on this idea.  I can see valid reasons both pro and con.

I belong to several other special interest groups that operate forum type websites similar to this one.  some have a paid membership qualification to join, some do not.  Most also have some sort of sales section.  Most also have experienced problems with individuals joining the site and doing nothing but selling stuff, no other participation.

  On one site particularly, dealing with collectable & historical stuff, somewhat equivalent to our single shots, we have had problems with unethical sales/deliveries,  and not just the normal discussion of "condition rating".  The problems have all come from these non-participating sellers.  Sadly it seems that all too often the site community gets blames when a deal goes bad. 
It is NOT a membership association, just a wide-spread community sharing a common interest.  As a result the site owner and moderators set up some sort of filter that only allows individuals who have been "on" the site for a while and who have been active in threads and discussions to do anything other than "view" the sales area.  guys who have been with the site for a while but who are not real active posters are allowed to PM one of the moderators and get approval to list or respond in the sales area.  It has stopped the shyster/scammer sellers.

I know that the BOD has always taken the view that the site was set up for the members and that the non-member single shot community was welcome to participate.  There have been occasions when the open privilege of using the site has been abused and used to attack the ASSRA that sponsors it---generally by non-ASSRA members with agendas and axes of their own to sharpen. 
My personal concern is less a matter of the financial aspects than it is the potential abuse of the site, its sales forum, and our active community of participants by unscrupulous and unethical sellers.
  

sacred cows make the best burger
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tommyauger
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Re: Members of the ASSRA and selling on this forum
Reply #17 - Feb 16th, 2011 at 11:33pm
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WOW
This really makes a guy think. I have been around this site for awhile I have never sold anything on the site but I have purchased more than a few things. I am not much of a magazine reader so I have never really thought about joining the ASSRA. What is the cost and what does a guy get for becoming a member? I would really like to continue to be able to read the Forum and even ask some dumb questions. What is this forum really for to have the same group of guys talk to each other or is it to try to get new people into the single shot shooting. Either way I should become a member to help support the forum I just hope I don't have to because someone told me to. Thanks TommyAuger
  

tommyauger
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westerner
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Re: Members of the ASSRA and selling on this forum
Reply #18 - Feb 16th, 2011 at 11:40pm
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Quote:
I am curious how many NON members have sold or have something for sale listed on this forum.

Seems many non members have posted how evil the association or members of the board are evil.

I am proposing at the next phone conference that only members can post items of any sort for sale must use their member number and expiration date that is on cards sent to each and every new, or renewed individual that sends in their dues to me the membership secretary.
IF that is not done the ad would be removed from the forum. ASAP.

I have noticed the sale sites get a cut of the sale on their web site. I'd think it wouldn't hurt for people using the forum that is paid for by the assoc, would at least be paid members.


KAFs  original post was perty simple and easy to understand. It would simply limit nonmembers from selling on the forum. Wont stop anyone from joining in any discussions.

                         Joe. 
  

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ssdave
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Re: Members of the ASSRA and selling on this forum
Reply #19 - Feb 16th, 2011 at 11:48pm
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Keith, I sit on the fence on this one.  I do not maintain a membership, since unmentonable events a couple of years ago.  For a long time I did not post either.  I have sold on the site, and I send a check about once a year to the association for an equivalent in Gunbroker fees for anything I sell here.  That check has  been bigger than the membership fee would be.

Selling on the site is, although this may sound self serving, a way to give things back to others that I share interests with here.  Ben Shelor and I used to have an interesting game we played with sales here.  We would talk about items, decide what they were worth, and then post them here for 70% of that.  We would leave them up until we received a lower offer than that price in emails or PM's or posts, and then take them down, and sell them on gunbroker to see what they would actually bring.  Once in a while, although it was rare, someone would actually buy them before we got a low ball offer, and of course, then they got the item at that price.  I miss Ben, we had a lot of amusement out of that game at times.  He had an odd sense of humor that sometimes matched mine.

Anyway, back on the topic, if you make it non-members only, I won't sell here, but I also won't join, so no advantage to the membership either way.  I also won't send the periodic checks, but you only have my word on that anyway, so haven't really lost anything firm there either.

I've never had a problem buying or selling on this site, regardless of whether the person was a member or not.  I'm not sure what perceived problem banning non-members would solve, but then again, I've never seen an advantage of secret societies.  I have had no problem with the attitude since I quit sending in my membership dues.  It's no longer my site, so I don't let any of the rules or attitudes get under my skin anymore.  It's a much more pleasant site to visit as a guest than as a member who cared.

dave
  
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Old Center Shot
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Re: Members of the ASSRA and selling on this forum
Reply #20 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 12:06am
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AND THERE YOU HAVE IT.  THANKS FOR REMINDING ME TOO JERRY. I HAD THOUGHT THIS FORUM WAS A SIDELINE OF THE ASSRA TO PROMOTE MEMBERSHIP ALSO.l LIKE YOU BEING A FORMER MEMBER I NO LONGER DESIRE TO REJOIN. I PROBABLY HAVE A DOZEN SS RIFLES AND HAVE BEEN SHOOTING CAST MOST OF MY LIFE. MY GOOD GUNS ARE STILL BOLT GUNS.
TOM


Well,
It may have been a sideline of ASSRA to get guys to join and promote membership,  but I guess it's not working very good if your still not a member and don't intend to join,  is there some reason us members that support ASSRA with our $$$ should listen to you and other non-members like you ?.
  O C S
  
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Re: Members of the ASSRA and selling on this forum
Reply #21 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 12:36am
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Some join, some do not. I enjoy the exchange of information. Hardly ever sell anything here. Buy from time to time and advertise for stuff I need or want. After all the discussion so far I am still not sure that anything good for most of us will come from charging for buying or selling  are requiring ASSRA membership. Is being a forum member a requirement to buy and sell? Been a long time since I looked at the rules of this game.
  
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Rich_Siegel
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Re: Members of the ASSRA and selling on this forum
Reply #22 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 9:36am
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I disagree with restricting the use of this board.  I started reading the board several years ago and got interested in the organization so I joined.  If people have something to sell, and it should be limited to rifles or other items used in conjuction with the spirit of the ASSRA, where is the harm.  I might buy something I could get elsewhere.  the only thing I like about voluntarily listing a ASSRA membership number is that I trust a member more then someone i don't know.  Buyer beware.

We, in the organization, should not appear to consider ourselves the elite.  We should go out of our way to encourage interested people to read, write, buy, sell and then maybe join the organization.  Lets not shoot ourselves in the foot and sour possible new members.   

Rich
  
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screwloosetc
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Re: Members of the ASSRA and selling on this forum
Reply #23 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 9:49am
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Rich
You are %100 correct.  OCS's money does not support this forum it will destroy it by driving prospective members away. What drives this forum are the people with experience to offer and willingness to share.
I think a certian number of posts should be required to have an opinion. same for sales. maby we should creat a knowitall status.Who wants to go first?
Tom
  
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Paul_F.
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Re: Members of the ASSRA and selling on this forum
Reply #24 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 12:15pm
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Interesting how some folks take this;

Quote:
I am proposing at the next phone conference that only members can post items of any sort for sale must use their member number and expiration date that is on cards sent to each and every new, or renewed individual that sends in their dues to me the membership secretary.


And immediately jump to the conclusion that someone wants to "restrict access to the forum to members".

Some folks read conspiracy into anything an ASSRA Board member says, I suppose.


Paul F.
  
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Old Center Shot
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Re: Members of the ASSRA and selling on this forum
Reply #25 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 12:23pm
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Quote:
Rich
You are %100 correct.  OCS's money does not support this forum it will destroy it by driving prospective members away. What drives this forum are the people with experience to offer and willingness to share.
I think a certian number of posts should be required to have an opinion. same for sales. maby we should creat a knowitall status.Who wants to go first?
Tom


 

Your saying that my money is not support for this forum, seems that you know more than you should for someone that's not a ASSRA member. do you have a dollar by dollar break down of what my money is used for ?. 

Please let me know what the money I send to ASSRA is used for if some of it is not used to support this forum, hope the officials are not using it for Beer and Pizza   Wink   Grin

Also please let us know how much you have paid to ASSRA to help support this forum. Or do you really think it's FREE.
 O C S
« Last Edit: Feb 17th, 2011 at 5:42pm by Jim_Borton »  
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jeffer1942
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Re: Members of the ASSRA and selling on this forum
Reply #26 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 2:51pm
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In reading all the posts, both pro and con, I am perplexed.  I was unaware that there was a problem on the site.  I have only seen one complaint recently and and that appears to be more misunderstanding than anything else. 

What this discussion has done is to reopen old wounds that should have been put to rest years ago.  

In my opinion this whole issue has been overblown.  "If it ain't broke, don't fix it"!  
  
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ssdave
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Re: Members of the ASSRA and selling on this forum
Reply #27 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 3:15pm
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westerner wrote on Feb 17th, 2011 at 1:34pm:
The non members seem to be squealing loudest now.  I love it!  Grin

             Joe.  Grin



No real surprise there, Joe.  People that aren't affected by an action rarely bother to even comment on it.  

However, this site is owned by ASSRA, and controlled by the BOD.  If they decide it is in the best interest of the organization to restrict sales to ASSRA Members, or even restrict access to ASSRA members, they are perfectly justified in doing so.  

Sometimes, we just have to remember it's just the internet.  This site has provided a "spot" to have a lot of people of like interests get together and discuss those interests.  It has also provided a sales area to sell stuff associated with those interests.  I have seen very little off topic stuff for sale, and have seen essentially no abuse of the privelege.  ASSRA has been very gracious to host the site and the sales.  If they choose not to, people will decide if it's worth the dues of an organization to have that access, or they can, and may, congregate somewhere else.  

I enjoy reading information posted here, occasionally buy something off the "for sale" area, (without worrying about member or non-member selling) and occasionally sell something single shot related.  But, it's not a big part of my life like the ASSRA is to the members who live near the sacred shooting site.  There's other places to sell, and most of the members I see here I can see just as easily on two or 3 other sites that they also frequent.  Life will go on for all of us, essentially unchanged, regardless of what policy ensues.  

The real question: is there any good reason for a policy change except spite?  If there is, the BOD should pursue that change.  If not, it falls in the category of "never pass up an opportunity to do something good for someone else if it costs you nothing, and always pass up the opportunity to do something mean.

dave


  
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JLouis
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Re: Members of the ASSRA and selling on this forum
Reply #28 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 3:20pm
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Very nicely written Dave I enjoyed reading your comment.

J.Louis
  

" It Is Better To Now Have Been A Has Been Than A Never Was Or A Wanna Be "
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screwloosetc
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Re: Members of the ASSRA and selling on this forum
Reply #29 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 4:56pm
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Joe
Warm up your paddle its going to get deeper.
OCS
But ScrewLoose, your not a member so it didn't work for you, or have you changed your mind now that you may be locked out of the forum ?.

Are you now in a position to make decisions concerning this forum?
As a point of fact.
Many years before you; I belonged to the ASSRA,shot at the range and joined this forum.I have seen many things. For someone with less than 50 posts you run your big mouth alot about stuff you know nothing of. There are non members here that contribute more than members. I do not dislike the ASSRA. in some ways I support it. There was a big rift here years ago and I am still here. I buy and sell nothing. If I did i would contribute a % of the sale to the board. Nothing wrong with a users fee. I try to give as much information as I get. Its called sharing. That is the function of this board. No one here is above anyone else. We have a moderator who keeps things in perspective. Are you the new moderator? I am opinionated but reasonable..
Tom
« Last Edit: Feb 17th, 2011 at 5:39pm by Jim_Borton »  
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