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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Original load data (Read 12700 times)
boats
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Re: Original load data
Reply #15 - Jan 25th, 2011 at 9:56pm
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38 Cal I would much prefer to use cast in the 30/30 however length of cartridge considered (rule is you have to feed from the magazine) it's hard to get 170 gr gas checked max length cast bullets to knock over the 56 lb ram at 200 meters. Now I could use jacketed at 2000 fps and cast for the other 3 targets but mixing cast and jacketed same gun same match with no time for cleaning between relays is not likely to be successful.

Right now two of us are working with 3 Marlins for the CLA match, 45/70 1895 new made gun with a 26 inch barrel and lead added to the buttstock 360 gr Flat nose plain base out of a Raphine mold. 22 grs of 4759. Same model in 38/55 using store bought 38 bullet and 4759. And the 30/30 it's a 36A 24 inch barrel full rifle 1947 vintage.  All the Marlins have had the front sights changed to post and Lyman 66 receiver sights.

If that's not enough we are using two M 1894's for the Pistol caliber match one old in 25/20 one new in 32/20.  Rimfire 3 39A 22's and a Model 39 22 Going to need a trailer to pull all this to Raton in July.

For the full size course Idea is to see what will hit the most critters and what the ram knockdown is gun to gun. Settle on one we will probably both shoot it trading off spotting and shooting relays.

Right now my money is on the 45/70 dowloaded it's easy to shoot and accurate. Have no doubts about it's ram knockdown.  None of this has anything to do with Single Shots except every bit of the load data has come from old manuals. New ones are mostly max velocity hunting loads.  Lessons learned from Single shot shooting have given us a leg up on the average lever gun shooter too.

Boats
« Last Edit: Jan 25th, 2011 at 10:18pm by boats »  
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38_Cal
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Re: Original load data
Reply #16 - Jan 25th, 2011 at 11:05pm
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Hey, Boats, that mould number I gave you is for a 120 gr. bullet for the chickens, pigs & turkeys!  You could probably use that data with the Lyman 311008 as well...that's a nominal 115 gr.

David

  

David Kaiser
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Re: Original load data
Reply #17 - Jan 26th, 2011 at 12:34pm
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David get all this testing and sorting out done I may well try some 30 cal cast bullets out of the 30/30 on Rams see how it does. 

It's a big job to haul 10 of the 56 lb rams from our 500 yard line to the 200 yard chicken line in order to test CLA knockdown's Right now the range is so muddy no way to even think about moving them.

When I do will have the 30/30 jackated 45/70 360 gr cast 38/55 265 gr and perhaps some of the 170 cast 30/30 loads. See what will fall what will not. Wack a few with my CPA 38/55 290 gr fixed loads same time.

Boats
  
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merle
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Re: Original load data
Reply #18 - Jan 28th, 2011 at 5:10pm
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Might be tuff to Compile ALL black powder loads.

I have a .41 Wesson two trigger rifle.    It's a Kittridge marked rifle.

Probably similar to the .44 Wesson extra long, but smaller and shorter. (A straight case).

No idea of the original load or bullet shape.   I'd bet it's a heeled bullet.
Oh yeah...you break it open like a shotgun by pulling the first trigger and you extract the empty with your fingers.

Sort of like the  Wesson Military carbine of the period, but definitly NOT a .44

Let me know when you find info on  that one.

Merle
  
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MIKE-T
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Re: Original load data
Reply #19 - Jan 28th, 2011 at 5:51pm
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Here is some basic data on Wesson cartridges that might help.
MIKE-T
  
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merle
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Re: Original load data
Reply #20 - Jan 29th, 2011 at 10:28am
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Thanks for the info.

I've made chamber casts and it is none of those.

Just to see if it will shoot,  I've machined 3 brass cartridges that will fit.  And I made a simple core bullet mold and shaped the nose of the cast bullets slightly in the lathe.

The cartridge is something like this but in .41 instead of .44
I once read that Frank Wesson was somewhat of a cartridge wildcatter of the times and that odd or unique chambering shows up often.  I think this is one of those.

The rifle is tapped for a cavalry sling.   

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Re: Original load data
Reply #21 - Jan 30th, 2011 at 5:59am
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I have a buddy that has a nice .44 Wesson.  He has worked up some pretty good loads for it too. Couple years ago at the Conestoga Gallery matches we used it to enter the over .40 cal class

Anything I say about the load could be wrong memory only but getting the right bullet was the problem.  He is a good tinkerer and will often make up swages cast bullets from other molds and turn bases down etc to get something shooting. I think he used the turn down trick on the Wesson

Boats
  
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merle
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Re: Original load data
Reply #22 - Jan 30th, 2011 at 10:13am
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I'm in the process of building some cartridges for this rifle.  And, as you say, the problem is getting the right bullet.

I picked up some thinwall brass tubing this is exactly chamber diameter along with some Brass rod.   I can turn a rim and silver solder the rim and tubing together to form a cartridge.   Then trim to length.  If you use BP, they work fine.   

I'm "tooling up" for this project.  Just finished a lathe dial indicator holder and carriage stop that will allow me to cut the tubing to the required length quickly, accurately and repeatedly.

I havn't researched it yet, but I think there are some hard cast .41 pistol rounds that might be worth experimenting with.

My first priority though is looking for some of the Rapine 56-56 spencer molds for a 56-56 Ballard centerfire conversion project that is finishing up.

Merle

Merle

  
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Re: Original load data
Reply #23 - Jan 30th, 2011 at 9:08pm
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If you like I wll ask him what he came up with. He's not on emails take a week or so and his rifle is a 44 but the general idea may be of some help

Boats
  
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merle
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Re: Original load data
Reply #24 - Feb 1st, 2011 at 10:11am
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The load data would be interesting.

If I get around to it, I might post a few pics of the rifle and the raw materials.  Maybe some of the machine work.

Can't get to the shop.   We're in the midst of a Blizzard.   40-50 mph wind with heavy snow.   Had thundersleet and thundersnow earlier.  Got 3 foot drifts in the driveway.    Forcast is for temps to hit 10 below zero at end of snow.   With the blizzard whiteout, can't see much past 200 yards.

Time for a hot drink.

Merle
  
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