Must be a typo most std velocity shorts are about 880 fps, but you never know what some ammo maker will come out with for special markets,

Boats

RWS site has the R25 at the bottom of this page:

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190 meters = 623.36 feet, rounded up

Here's the most complete listing that I know of:

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Merwin, I hope you can get some you like.  I notice that several of the things at .22ammo are not in stock, and have not been, for a long time.

If you find some that work well, or don't, will you post a report?

Thanks.

Serena

Vintageliving --------thanks for the link to a good, informative site and welcome to the forum!
Regards, Joe

Vintageliving-Thanks for the info--very helpful in format and availability,
                                                                                   Fritz

I have been testing 22 Shorts in a couple of Winders.  I am using one (with fancy sights) in the WSU 2009 Winter League.  Those are offhand at 50 feet, either gallery or outdoors.   So far I have used CCI Target and Fiocchi Super Target.  

I gave some thought to using Aquila Target Shorts, but the product reviews posted somewhere gave that stuff thumbs down and said "don't waste your money".  So I passed on the Aquila target shorts.

I have proven to myself that the CCI Target Shorts from my Winder will stay in the 25-ring at 50 feet (from the bench) and that I have no one to blame but myself for less than perfect scores.  The jury is still out on the results at 25 yards.  At 50 yards, no wind and the gods all smiling, a 1" group might be possible, but 2" will be a lot more common.   

The Fiocchi Super Target has not been subject to as much testing.  I only had one carton.  But at 50 yards, it shot a couple of groups that were smaller than any of the CCI groups, and one group that was larger.  

All the above is with the cartridges just taken out of the box, with no sorting.

There are at least 3 caveats with the Fiocchi stuff.  First, I have noted that some times the bullet leaves the barrel and goes to parts unknown.  Not through the target paper, even at 50 feet.  Second. one of the cartridges detonated.  The bullet remained in the case, but the case blew open with a big flash and BANG.  All the debris went straight up, because the part of the case that failed just happened to be oriented in that position.  And third, the residue feels very granular.  Do they use ground glass for priming?  And do you want that stuff in a high-priced rifle barrel?

I tried to get some bargain-basement priced RWS-25s and Russian Vostoks, but was too late.  Both batches were sold out.  I ordered some RWS-25s and some Eley Rapid-Fire Pistol Match but suffered buyer's remorse and canceled the order.  $400 for 3 bricks of Shorts seemed a bit much.

But I now have 2 more bricks of the Fiocchi stuff.  I am going to weigh each round and sort the stuff by weight.  I will do the same with CCI Target Shorts.  Then I will shoot some more groups.  And I'll try to lay hands on a chronograph, to see if the velocity varies by weight.

Friend Waterman,

I have an old beat up 3rd Model Winder which when I bought it years ago had the original 22 Short barrel which is not in the best of condition and was, at some time in the past, re-chambered to "22 Long R" probably by R. F. Sedgley, and to add insult to injury it has a ring in the middle of it. Now, regardless of the barrel's less than perfect condition, using CCI 22 Short Target ammo, I shot a 25 yard 10 shot group that I could cover with the tip of my little finger, as I recall I was using a Lyman 438 scope. At that point I stopped looking for 22 Short ammo and stocked up on the CCI Short Target.

Bob

PS I have had very bad luck with the Aguila Golden Eagle Target ammo.

Richard,

I'm about to leave to go shooting at "Windy Acres Gun Club," unfortunatly, we don't get enough rain out here to conduct a proper deflection test, perhaps Joe "Westerner" or some of his buds from the Pacific Northwest could figure it out, I did want to say that Midway has a sale on 22 Ammunition and has the best prices I've seen recently. Such is life in the far west.

Bob

If it was caused by deflection, then why would it be 3" low? Some of those drops had to be hitting the underside of the bullet nose, which would have driven the bullet upwards. Something going on with all shots being 3" low.

For the raindrop to impact the bottom of the bullet, the bullet would have to hit the raindrop.  Raindrops are "raindrop" shaped, so if the bottom of the bullet hit the raindrop, it would only hit the tapered upper end of a downward moving mass. 

Assume a velocity of 750 fps for the 22 Short bullet.  Ignore deceleration (since I can't deal with it) and we have a time of flight over 25 yards of 0.1 seconds.

The bullet can hit any raindrop (or vice versa) within a path that is one bullet diameter plus one-half a uniform raindrop diameter on either side of the bullet.  With big uniform raindrops, that diameter is .25".  So the path width is 0.47"

With a steady one-hour rain dropping 2" of rain, a path 75 feet (900 inches) long x 0.47" wide will be hit by 110,122 raindrops in one hour.  Neglecting gravitational acceleration, bullet deceleration, bullet spin (450 revs per second) and the bullet trajectory (all beyond my elderly math skills), the bullet will be hit by (or will hit) 3 raindrops on its path to the target.

I think that is enough to deflect the bullet, but would the deflection be 3 inches?  Without getting into vectors, and again, I have fuzzy math skills, if a single raindrop with a downward velocity of 24 fps hits a bullet with a velocity of 750 fps, the result can be thought of a change in direction and can be thought of as a tangent function.  The arc tangent of 24/750 is one degree and 50 minutes.  If the raindrop was a solid of the same density as the bullet and if the bullet was not spinning, the bullet would be deflected by almost 2 degrees, or 27" at 25 yards.  Since the raindrop is much less dense and since the bullet is spinning, the deflection will be much less.  But I think I can believe a 3" deflection, especially if we include the downdraft factor.

Downdraft must also be a factor.  As must the angle between the rifle barrel and the target.  I made no effort to correct for that angle, which could well have been negative.  I often staple 3 targets in a vertical column.

Richard