I see someone has posted the black powder explosion test again.  While one person ran one test and it's repeated often on the Internet powder and suspended material fires are real and very dangerous.  It's NOT a myth.

I know the range mentioned below and have shot in it before. The bay that exploded holds 6 shooters, suspended material could only have come from those 6 shooters with pistols in an area 25 yards long by about  30 feet wide. & 10 feet high. The bays have  forced air ventilation that may or may not have been operating at the time. While the place is not well run the problem is one that could happen in other places through ignorance of potential danger. 

Point is a lot of cubic feet and very little suspended material caused a serious situation.  While not in the news article local officials have speculated unburned powder in the air put the danger level over the top.

Loading a single case full of black powder to my knowledge has not been proven to be dangerous.  Somewhere between that single case full of black and 6 shooters on an indoor range using smokeless there is a danger line.  

Watch the guy who tried to ignite black powder with a spark on the internet, be real carefull when handling powder yourself. He did not duplicate the potentialy dangerious conditon. A pile of sold materal is  not the same as suspended dust.

Boats


The Virginian-Pilot
© May 13, 2008 
VIRGINIA BEACH

The fire that ripped through an indoor shooting range Sunday, injuring seven people, is the latest in a string of problems at the facility.

In the past year, A&P Arms' Lynnhaven Shooting Range has been cited for worker safety violations; had a former manager sent to prison for stealing, selling and giving away guns; and has its license under investigation by the U.S. Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.

Sunday's fire, which is under investigation, was the third at the business in the past 15 years, fire officials said.

Four of the injured are hospitalized but are doing better, Battalion Chief Leon Dextradeur said.

"They are all upright and talking and have different levels of burn injuries, but none appears to be critical at this time," he said.

A&P Arms is owned by Shooting Sports Distributors Inc. The president of the company is Norman Gladden Jr., according to state records. He did not respond to voice messages Monday on his cell phone and at the store.

A message on the store's answering machine said, "We are temporarily closed and will reopen as soon as possible."

The fire started in one of the store's three shooting lanes and ignited a wood divider that separates them, Dextradeur said.

"With the backing they use to catch the bullets, you'll get lead and other debris that will back up there," said Mike Campbell, spokesman for the ATF. "Depending on their cleaning method, you may get a spark that will start a fire.

"I don't know if there was material that hadn't been cleared out or what. That appears to be what happened at Woodbridge and maybe happened here," Campbell said.

In March 2007, a fire engulfed Shooter's Paradise, a gun store and firing range in Woodbridge in Northern Virginia. No one was injured.

In 1994, an explosion sparked a fire at the A&P shooting range. No one was hurt. An accumulation of chemicals may have caused that fire, officials said at the time.

In June, A&P Arms was fined $1,740 after being cited for five violations by the U.S. Department of Labor's Occupational Safety and Health Administration.

The violations were for "lead, inorganic fumes and dusts" and employee exposure to sodium hydroxide.

Last month, a former store manager was sentenced to 15 months for stealing firearms, including a submachine gun. ATF agents identified 51 guns that Marcus A. McCall sold, gave away or kept in his Virginia Beach home, according to court records. McCall worked at the A&P Arms store in Hampton, but often transported guns to the Virginia Beach store, court records showed.

The store's ATF license is under review, confirmed Campbell. He said the investigation is not related to Sunday's fire but declined to give details.

Aaron Applegate, (757) 222-5122, aaron.applegate@pilotonline.com

Dust explosions are a far different thing than solid material explosions. As mentioned just about any dust particle can be exploded. An example would be a friend of mine who was welding 14 ft. down in the bottom of a grain elevator when it blew off. With the resulting fire he was lucky to get out of there alive. Even after several hours of forced ventilation the mishap still occurred.

  Talking to a local fire fighter friend about powder being set off in a fire, he said their biggest concern was all those primers laying around the loading room. Don't know if he even thought of the possibility of BP.

  Often wondered if the can BP comes in was tight enuf to cause an explosion if heated to the cooking off point.

  Another thing that's always had me wondering. If the danger of static electricity was so great in connection with BP how come most of it is shipped in steel cans. It would seem to me that if static was such a danger with BP steel cans would be the last thing they would ship the stuff in.

PETE

They were shooting black powder indoors! Everyone knows the smoking section is outside.

Other than a saloon in Dodge City in the 1880, have others been doing this these days?
Regards, Ron

A few years ago I read a story about the construction of a shooting baffle, to mitigate the noise. The baffle box was constructed of plywood sheets and had dimensions of ~ 4'x4'x8' with holes in both ends and was lined with roll insulation batting. The noise reduction was effective, however the accumulated unburned (smokeless rifle) powder eventually ignited and significantly altered the shape of the baffle box. Didn't blow it completely up but did require that it be strengthened when reassembled. This was printed in a national magazine but CRS has me firmly in its grip & I don't remember which one.
FYI, good luck, Joe

All electronic components are today packed in antistatic plastic bags, I wonder if the Swiss powder plastic container is made of antistatic plastic to, and why the manufactors of powder measures dont use this materials, maybe they then have more products to sell.

Michael

TenX,
That's High density Polyethylene.  It is not antistatic.  Elephant used to use similar plastic bottles.

As for the shipping of BP in wood casks and lead containers in the "Good Old Days", it wasn't to eliminate static, it's because that's what they had.  No plastics then.

Jerry Liles

Glock had a similar accident in their shooting tunnel several years ago that injured three people.  It was reported that the fire was was started when a spark from shooting ignited accumulated unburned powder down range.

I know that one indoor range I trained on had a mandatory sweep down after each training session. You would be surprised how much powder residue was swept up.

Bill, I wouldn't be too worried about an outdoor structure that would admit rainwater into its interior. The baffle box I cited was installed indoors and IMO rainwater would eliminate the worry, IF it had good access to the powder remainder.

But you can inform your members that unburned smokeless powder accumulations will most certainly ignite, with sometimes spectacular results. The baffle box cited was much larger and constructed of wood, and bulged & separated significantly upon the powder ignition, thus sparing the shooter much of the potential backblast. I, for one, would hate to be on the receiving end of a powder blast contained by steel drums with no relief holes in them!
Good luck, Joe