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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens (Read 16127 times)
bnice
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #15 - Feb 18th, 2008 at 12:42pm
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The short barrel not only decreases time in the barrel, but according to anschutz .22 LR reaches max (2013 series) velocity after 18-20 inches in the barrel so nothing is gained by going longer. With a blop tube or backbored barrel you still get the sight radius without the down sides.
  
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Redwing
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #16 - Feb 18th, 2008 at 12:44pm
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Hi All !!!

No such thing as an ugly rifle !!! Just some better !!!

My most accurate rimfire rifle’s are: M-35 NRA Mossberg, M-44a Mossberg, M-52c Winchester.. However, the most prettiest are my single shot’s…

I shoot the flies off the targets at 75’… As long as the gun is consistent, its up to the shooter to hit the target.. Like Carnage Hall   Practice, practice, practice…..

Ed….
  
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bnice
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #17 - Feb 18th, 2008 at 12:44pm
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By the way is back boring considered traditional?
  
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J.D.Steele
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens
Reply #18 - Feb 18th, 2008 at 1:07pm
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Dale53 wrote on Feb 18th, 2008 at 12:54am:
>>>22RF target rifles, that they will almost always shoot much more accurately, that is, produce smaller groups, from the prone position than from the bench.<<<

This is absolutely an urban myth. If you don't believe this, just look at the modern .22 bench rest groups. I defy ANYONE to equal those from prone. I shot smallbore for several years and while I have met some National Champions, I NEVER saw them equal the groups now being shot with modern bench .22's. I know that, before modern .22 benchrest arrived, that some VERY good prone shooters firmly believed this but the records don't lie.

Dale53


My statement applied to traditional 4-Position rifles with the traditional longer barrels of over 28" or so. Please don't compare the short-barreled modern BR rifles, they're not the same and they don't behave the same way. I personally haven't tried this experiment and so have only some folks' word for it, but I can't dismiss it as merely an urban myth without some rather convincing evidence comparing apples with apples. Comparing a 28"-bbld wood-stocked Winchester 52 with a modern short-bbld fiberglass-stocked Benchrest rifle is like comparing apples with oranges.

The crux of this discussion is 22RF accuracy, and the direction of discussion has turned toward decreased bbl time and/or vibration dampening and its effect on accuracy. Ask these same modern BR recordholders just how well their rifles would group from the bench with the longer 28"-30" position rifle barrels and without the tuners; I can imagine what they'd say!

Apples with oranges.

I agree that the statement MAY be only an urban myth, but I personally have so far seen no real evidence, either for it or against it, other than the opinions of some shooters and writers.

My shooting skills are mediocre at best, perhaps someone more skilled could conduct this experiment and report the results. That would certainly be better than what we have now.
Regards, Joe
  
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leadball
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #19 - Feb 18th, 2008 at 4:39pm
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bnice;
          I don't know exactly what a traditional rifle is, everyone will have a different formula but I'm pretty sure backboring would be within the rules of ASSRA.   leadball
  
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boats
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #20 - Feb 18th, 2008 at 5:30pm
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Myth or not I can't shoot groups benchrest with my Anschutz 52 as small as I can prone, coat sling and glove.  I bet the best 22 bench rest shooter in the country can't shoot groups laying on his belly as small as he can from a rest.

It's what the rifle is built for and your ability to shoot it.  Switch disciplines and your are starting from scratch.  However this proves nothing only way to test rimfire accuracy is from a machine rest indoors.  Only way to test  Human ability is in a match. The two don't always mix.

Boats
  
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #21 - Feb 18th, 2008 at 6:37pm
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10-4 to BSA and accuracy.  But also had a relined Ballard that was very accurate, which fact I didn't find out until it was sold to friend in New Mexico who found out it tended to lead just enough to degrade accuracy from match grade to non-competitive.  Never liked to clean rimfires.  My bad!  PS Which is uglier, BSA or Hepburn?
  
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens
Reply #22 - Feb 18th, 2008 at 6:47pm
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Look at this site for the pretty .22rf Hepburn:   


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westerner
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #23 - Feb 18th, 2008 at 6:49pm
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So then, if we can get by an ugly rifle, I still say its very hard [not impossible] to build a 22Rf  rifle that will out-shoot a BSA Intl.--- I've discovered that if you win a few matches they become less ugly. leadball


Leadball, 
I shot a 498 this Sunday off the bench against a large number of BSA target rifles.
Second place was a 488. I used my trusty old 417 Walnut Hill Heavy. Three pound trigger and no through bolt in the stock. The scope was an old Lyman STS 20# Hardly any finish left on the scope or rifle.
My rifle is no looker, but, it dont look as bad as some of Chuck Blenders rifles. LOL ! 

It doesnt matter what kind of action you use. A good barrel and good ammo and good windflags and lots of practice will get you in the winners circle.    Wink   


                                                                      Joe.






  
A blind squirrel runs into a tree every once in a while.
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Tar_Baby
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #24 - Feb 18th, 2008 at 7:27pm
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Brent would like your autograph
  
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JDA
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #25 - Feb 18th, 2008 at 7:48pm
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Westerner,

Thanks for that last post.  Makes my case at least.  I started with absolute junk trapdoor parts and ended up with a beautiful little trapdoor carbine in .22 rf.  Most of the parts are original and the rifle functions flawlessly.  Originally, only two added parts; a Remington 580 barrel and a cartridge "carrier".  Rifle loads and shoots just like an original.  Well, actualy much better than an original.  Accuracy is very good and regularly shoots to 3/4" at 50 yds.

That was last year.  Since then I've added a few improvements such as lightened hammer, speed tumbler and a well fit stock.  Barrel is now adjustable for head space.  It still looks like a trapdoor except the hammer looks like it came from a '51 Navy Colt.

This year I am looking for better accuracy but I may keep bumping up against me.   

JDA
  
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Brent
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #26 - Feb 18th, 2008 at 9:03pm
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Brent would like your autograph


that can be arranged - but why for?   

Brent

  
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westerner
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #27 - Feb 18th, 2008 at 9:07pm
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Brent would like your autograph

 

Ben, how you doing on them borders ?

Now I know, Brent dont want no part of me. Har har har !!

JDA, that's cool !!  Ron Heilman has a .22 trapdoor too.  He practices in his shop with it. As long as the hammer hits the same every time it should shoot good.  Wink

                                                                            Joe.

                       

                                                           
  
A blind squirrel runs into a tree every once in a while.
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marlinguy
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Ballards may be weaker,
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #28 - Feb 18th, 2008 at 9:20pm
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Dave,
I think the Ballard is the one I would use, because of the through bolt, but mainly because of the two pice extractor that the little #3 action used. It's always pleased me with it's reliability, and positive extraction.
I own  Stevens 44 that was built into a schuetzen rifle, and it's probably the most accurate .22 singleshot I own. I love it, but my one complaint is the 6 o'clock extractor, and the fact that it doesn't move the empties out far enough for my big fingers to grab easily. I'm selling my 44 soon, and going to build something up on a Ballard #3 action myself.-Vall
  
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Tar_Baby
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #29 - Feb 18th, 2008 at 10:36pm
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JUST TRY TO SPOOL YOU FELLOWS UP A LITTLE --the borders are fine when paid for. Smileydon't use them a lot. when i need them done i send down to ken then i charge for the job. this is just some of my smart a---- stuff not to be paid much attention to. some times i wish it was easy to color inside the lines. regards.ben
  
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