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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens (Read 16091 times)
First_Shirt
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens
Feb 16th, 2008 at 10:47pm
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Dave, I don't think you could really go wrong with any of those actions for a fine .22 competition gun.  I'm in the finishing stages of my second Stevens 44 rebuild in the last couple of years, and I kinda like them for .22's.  There is way more than ample leverage in the swinging breech to easily seat rounds in a full-match chamber, they have a rather dainty hammer fall that doesn't upset the aim badly, and a pretty good single trigger.  The one we built for .22 silhouette has a sweet 12 oz trigger job (thanks, Glenn!)

The 44 1/2's have the advantage of a removable trigger unit...I think that a set of CPA double-sets can be fitted to the original action pretty easily.  Since you appear to be flush with those actions, a matched set stocked for bench and offhand would be REALLY neat.  Wink

And of course, the Ballard is a "legendary" platform for an accurate .22...

Greg
  
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J.D.Steele
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #1 - Feb 16th, 2008 at 11:03pm
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For me the choice is a no-brainer.

IMO Lilja makes the best barrels of those you mentioned. and the Ballard is also IMO by far the most inherently accurate action of those you mentioned. JMO, I would use this combination for my heavy rifle if I wuz you.

The 44 when rebuilt would be super for a lighter sporter-type rifle, even better if converted to use a drawbolt.

I'm currently finishing a back-bored #1 wall barrel with a 10" liner for a lightweight sporter and will later do the same for a heavier #2 one also. The length of the liner makes no difference with the legality as long as the unremoveable shell is at least 16" long; the 'unremoveable' requirement has been well proven with the many paramilitary weapons that have had their original short bbls extended in order to meet import or manufacturing requirements. Can't get much more 'unremoveable' than the entire barrel shell!

FWIW I've had mediocre results with Shilen 22RF bbls; been using them in preference over Douglas because of their rep but have been underwhelmed by the last several. OTOH a new 30" Douglas 30-cal air-gaged blank has proven to be superbly accurate, sub-half-MOA, easily enough to make me start using Douglas again! FWIW.
Regards, Joe
  
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First_Shirt
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens
Reply #2 - Feb 17th, 2008 at 8:32am
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Joe, interesting comments re: barrel manufacturers.  I have in hand a Douglas .30 caliber tube that is going on the schuetzenRuger project, I hope it shoots as well as yours!

I helped (did the stock-work) build a pretty neat CPA with a back-bored barrel system (sorta).  On this one, the outer shell was a Green Mountain #5 weight octagon barrel, in .50 caliber, that was pulled from the production line after drilling/reaming, before rifling.  The inner tube was a second Green Mountain .22 caliber blank, that was turned to fit inside the .50 caliber tube.  The trick part is, the liner only firmly attaches at the breech with, IIRC, a couple of small fillister screws (kinda like the breech face of a M-N firing pin bushing), and the tube of the insert rides on several rubber "O" rings.  With this system, the gunsmith can try various barrel manufacturers, barrel lengths, etc...tuning the gun from the inside out, as it were

This rifle was a purpose-built O/H gun, and has several 250's to it's credit in gallery matches already...but of course the owner is an exceptional shot  Wink .

Greg
  
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #3 - Feb 17th, 2008 at 9:08am
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SS Dave

Why not a low wall ?  to me they would be the action best for a rimfire offhand gun.  The functionality of extracting reloading etc is real important to long offhand strings. More so than the absolute accuracy required for bench shooting. Of course the most important thing is the trigger followed close by lock time.

I shoot a CPA rimfire and while the rifle is very accurate after 10 years it still bothers me on extraction.  Have to pull the case out with a fingernail and more times than not it drops in the action over the lowered block.  You don't have to pick it out and when raising the block on the fresh cartridge the old one pushes out, still it's annoying.

Something that's cut away or low would be better. Have seen High walls with the left side of the action cut away allowing better access to the chamber.

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leadball
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #4 - Feb 17th, 2008 at 11:26am
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ssdave;
            I don't think you could go wrong with any of your choices, I shoot all of these actions in 22RF but my first choice would be the 44.5 Stevens because of the parts available for this action, its also takedown.  I have a Ballard in 22RF that I use for OH IS rimfire, they make a dandy 22 until you drop a spent case down in the action, if your action does not have the rimfire extractor I'd use it for another project. I have a couple nice 44 Stevens 22's but I don't think they compare with the other's.
            I've spent several hundred dollar's on 22RF singleshots and after I put all these expensive parts together they WON'T outshoot my BSA  MK 1V Intl.--I know their ugly but they work.   leadball


  
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #5 - Feb 17th, 2008 at 12:19pm
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The 44.5 is a good choise for 22rf because of the way the breech block cams the round into the chamber! Something to think about if you plan on a match chamber! Thumb can get mighty sore pushing round into a match chamber! Tongue
  

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rimfire
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #6 - Feb 17th, 2008 at 1:29pm
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remeber if you back bore to get the backbore large enough - I have always heard a minimum of 3X grove dia - but I am thinking .75 or larger wouldn't hurt - does anyone know for sure? - you have a great day now - the rimfire - cdpersons
  
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #7 - Feb 17th, 2008 at 1:51pm
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rimfire,

That is the question I asked under Gunsmithing.  Is there a minimum freebore for a .22?  I've heard some speculation, but am not aware of anything authoritative.

Paul
  
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens
Reply #8 - Feb 17th, 2008 at 2:48pm
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There's of course the obvious option - buy a good Martini, best would be one of the offhand models  like the Int'l Mk IV ISU.  Good barrel, fine (and fast!) trigger, good sights...  Hard to fault that combination, and probably a whole lot cheaper than any of the other options.  And remember - beautiful is as beautiful does!
  
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leadball
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #9 - Feb 17th, 2008 at 6:14pm
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ssdave;
            The Stevens 44.5 feature that Jim B mentions, the rocking breechblock is the one feature tht makes the Stevens 44.5 the best of all the singleshots [IMO] it is invaluable when shooting match ammo, it also works well shooting BR breechseating the bullet, all falling block rifles original or modern should have had this feature, maybe there was a patent on the rocking breechblock.   leadball
  
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J.D.Steele
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #10 - Feb 17th, 2008 at 10:34pm
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Ballards and low walls also seat ammo in a match chamber quite handily, and low walls also have the advantage of incorporating the kicking ejector if wanted. The Stevens rifles are nice for 22s but I personally would want a drawbolt buttstock attachment. I'm currently experimenting with a different extractor/ignition system for the low wall since I consider the factory setup to be inferior, kinda like the cheesy wood screw buttstock attachment on some Stevens rifles. IMO both need improvements that can easily be incorporated during the rework of the rifles. The two-piece Ballard 22RF extractor is easily accessible and, if properly constructed, will hold the extracted cartridge in place for removal by the shooter's finger or nail.

I personally believe that accuracy with a 22RF will be greatly enhanced by having a shorter effective barrel length, to reduce any wandering/vibration between the time of the priming ignition and the bullet's exit from the end of the rifled portion of the barrel (barrel time). I also believe that this wandering/vibration explains the well-known phenomenon of almost all 22RF target rifles, that they will almost always shoot much more accurately, that is, produce smaller groups, from the prone position than from the bench. I believe the tight sling somewhat dampens the unplanned movement and wandering/vibration; at any rate this accuracy anomaly is well-known to many Smallbore shooters, and I believe that a shorter rifled portion can only improve matters. Experiments continue.
Regards, Joe
  
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens
Reply #11 - Feb 18th, 2008 at 12:54am
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>>>22RF target rifles, that they will almost always shoot much more accurately, that is, produce smaller groups, from the prone position than from the bench.<<<

This is absolutely an urban myth. If you don't believe this, just look at the modern .22 bench rest groups. I defy ANYONE to equal those from prone. I shot smallbore for several years and while I have met some National Champions, I NEVER saw them equal the groups now being shot with modern bench .22's. I know that, before modern .22 benchrest arrived, that some VERY good prone shooters firmly believed this but the records don't lie.

Dale53
  
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #12 - Feb 18th, 2008 at 9:15am
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If Smallbore Silhouette is any judge offhand accuracy in rimfires is enhanced by short barrels.  It's barrel time in my opinion.  Having said that and owning a short barrel T/C  that I shoot Silouette with would not want one for Schuetzen.   Too ugly

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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #13 - Feb 18th, 2008 at 9:55am
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What does ugly have to do with shooting good?
If ugly made a rifle shoot bad, Charlie Blender would have never won anything!   Shocked
  

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leadball
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Re: How to build best .22?  Ballard, Stevens 44,
Reply #14 - Feb 18th, 2008 at 10:59am
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So then, if we can get by an ugly rifle, I still say its very hard [not impossible] to build a 22Rf  rifle that will out-shoot a BSA Intl.--- I've discovered that if you win a few matches they become less ugly. leadball
  
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