hey guys, posted this thread a few years ago and thought i'd "cast" it out there again to see if anyone has any new suggestions.  i'm searching for a lighter chicken bullet than the current 545 grain bullet that works so well in my 45-70, twist in 18" barrel. my gun so far dislikes the 430 hoke and another noname 410 grainer. 8" at 200 yards from the bench...yikes!!! accuracy being paramount when trying to hit those blasted chickens, but the 545 just strikes me as 'overkill". however, until i find a good light weight , [sub 500 grains], bullet to fill my chicken requirements, i'm staying heavy. anybody out there shooting something lighter, with good accuracy or should i just stick with the heavy bullet and good accuracy...this is confounding!!!! thanks......blue

It's not what you need given BPCS rules. 

However the winning load at Fairfax Rod and Gun clubs single shot offhand 200 yard matches is often in a 45/70 Trapdoor. Almost all use the 330 gr Gould bullet cast without the hollow point. Loaded just over sub sonic with light charges of W 231 pistol powder.

It recoils like a .22 and is very accurate.  How you would duplicate it with Black I don't know.

Boats

I've had pretty good results with a RCBS 405 gr. gas check mold (with the base bored out to groove dia.) over 60 gr. Swiss 1 1/2, and a Fed 210M primer.  recoil is noticably less than my "stick" load...72 gr. Swiss 1 1/2 under a 500 gr. B&D.

Greg

thanx boats, froggy and shirt...i'll try the ol'405 in both the lyman and RCBS configurations. i have a bunch of swiss #3 on hand so we'll start with it....who knows??? first_shirt, how well does the RCBS perform off the bench at 200 yards....2 1/2"-3" ????? i'm assuming you shoot a 1:18" twist also. i would also be happy with a good, solid performer in the 450 grain range...just haven't found it yet, i have a pretty good bullet from B&D that weighs in at 498 grains... i don't really mind shooting that big, 545 grain bullet through the whole match...it's necessary for the rams and turkeys, [ at least from the accuracy standpoint], it just seems overkill on those chickens i keep missing. any of you guys had success with a 450-475 grain bullet.....again....thanx

Just my own thoughts......................

Your rifle has a pitch of 18". That seems to be the common twist in these days of 500+ grain bullets in the .45-70. Many of the originals were cut with a twist of 20" and slower. Most of them did well with lighter bullets too 350-400 grains.

I suspect part of your quandry may have something to do with the old bullet length- twist ratio. Maybe the twist is to fast to properly stabilize the lighter recoiling bullets you seek.

I can only speak from personal experience. I have a Shiloh .45-70 which shoots a 500 grain Gov't bullet as well as I can hold. Replace that bullet with a 385 grain Lyman 457124, and I end up with about 4"-5" group at 100 yards. Expand that out to 8"-10" at 200 yards and you're probably out of the game. Never mind the fact that you have to hold steady too!

Consider heeding the advise earlier offered..............just suck up the bump fron your regular loads. Focus on the mental part of it, get though it and overcome. I'll bet you find your scores will come up also!.

Regards, Bruce

OK, for the gamers out there, how about this idea?  Since paper patching is an old and honored strategy, why not make a paper mache sabot and shoot .40 or even .38 cal bullets at the short distances?  No need to thank me, guys, just trying to help out! 

Froggie

bluesteel45,

Like Froggie, I would like to offer a suggestion but one that is not as radical as the one he proposed.  I must admit that I use the same heavy bullets for all animals because I didn't want to take different loads to a match and either select the wrong load or run out of the correct ammunition.

If I presume correctly, you are probably shooting soft bullets of either a 1/20 or 1/30 tin lead alloy.  Try hardening your alloy for the shorter, lighter weight bullets.  Heavy bullets have long bearing sections to engage the fast twist rifling.  Since the rotational force is spread over a long area, there is less tendency for the rifling to distort the bearing surface.  Light bullets have a shorter bearing section and the rotational force could be distorting the bearing surface so badly that the bullets become inaccurate.

I have a fast twist 38 caliber rifle that I shoot using black powder and I couldn't get consistent accuracy until I started shooting an alloy that was composed of wheelweights and 2% tin.  Now the rifle will shoot more accurately than I can.  It is hard enough to withstand distortion yet soft enough to work with black powder.

It's just a suggestion but it might solve your problem and save you some new mould expenses.

feather