Figured that's start a discussion.

I just received a new cleaning rod set for my "high grade" 22s.  After doing a lot of reading on the rimfire benchrest forum at benchrest.com on cleaning I'm still a bit confused.  However there was a long and interesting discussion of cleaning rods.  Not a lot of concensus about many things but it is black and white among the br50 guys that poor fitting and improperly handled rods do more damage to high quality 22rf barrels than anything else.

the current feeling is that the coated rods, and even worse brass or AL rods, may pick up the very fine hard glassy grit left behind by the priming compound and grind it into the rifling especially at the throat and muzzle.

the "best" rods are considered to be spring tempered hardened steel that is precisely fitted to the bore and hardened so it won't pick up the grit.   Aparantly there was one maker who made superlative rods of this type but had quit doing so.  Another maker has just started making them and they are also veryhighly regarded.  (fwiw Bill Calfee evaluated them and gave them a very good rating)   The maker is just setting his web site up but you can try (You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) or contact him directly for info at denphillips2  at  earthlink.com / phone 608-931-0137

Since I just spent some $$$ on rebarrelling the ASSRA Ruger#1 to 22rf and I have several others that are also quite accurate and deservethe best care possible; I decided to contact the new rodmaker and see about a set. I got a long rod with a rotating handle and a short one with a fixed handle for chamber and throat cleaning.  I just received them yesterday and they are really really nice.  I'll have them with my stuff at OCGA and then pass them on to Sir Frog for his evaluation IF he promises to get them back to me for the Spring Shoot.

NOW FOR MY QUESTIONS  Now that I have a real good cleaning rod set what about "bore guides"?  All of the BR50 discussion about cleaning emphasises the use of precisely fitted rod guides or bore guides to make sure the rod is properly centered.  What/How can we come up with bore guides for our single shot actions?  if one is serious about 22rfcompetition and long range accuracy should bore guides be a concern for us?

I clean my CPA 22 after I shoot. I know that many never clean but I can't bear to let it sit without cleaning it. I run one wet patch of Bore Tech rimfire solvent through the bore follow with a dry patch and then one patch of lanolin to protect the bore.

40 Rod

You are probably not going to like my answer but since I've followed this whole BR rod debate from the beginning, and I shoot a lot of .22 BR here goes. The hard steel rod approach is very dependent on a "precise" and "tight fitting" bore guide. A big issue is that in a bench gun being a bolt action, you have the ability to have enough distance before the chamber to properly guide the rod. No single shot action will allow these critically important issues to be addressed. It should be noted that while smiths like Calfee and Myers advocate them, barrel makers cringe at the thought. I have one but rarely use it. I use and see more and more of the current crop of very stiff carbon rods or a quality coated rod that has a coating that is always checked for scratches and wiped after each pass. That tight bore guide for the uncoated rod requires several inches of guide for proper allignment.

I'll take things in a sligtly different direction...

For the most part, I'm one of those guys that lends more credence to the hard smooth rod vs the soft plastic coating. 
While cleaning, we're not putting the kinds of pressures on a hard steel rod against the bore to do any meaningful damage... whereas if crud DOES get embedded in a coated rod (and I'm not saying it does.. just IF), there is enough sliding pressure to abrade the bore.

Now... that said...
For my "routine" cleaning of my Anschutz prone rifle, I use a weed-whacker line pull-through. One wet patch, 2-3 dry patches.   
I do this every 500 or so rounds.

I make new pull-throughs often. If I think my plastic line pull through is the least bit dirty, I toss it. It's maybe a dimes worth of line.

I do not "rod clean" my rifle but once or twice a year. Typically at the end of a shooting season, and the beginning.   
When I DO rod clean my rifle, I use a bore guide. I use a hard steel rod. I use a nylon bristle brush.
In my experience, I have never needed very agressive cleaning in a good .22 match rifle bore. If I needed agressive scrubbing, it would be time for a new barrel!

Hope this lends some useful perspective!
Paul F.

tim_s;

We are speaking from different conditions, and with different expectations..
A prone rifle is not a bench rifle, and a bench rifle is not a prone rifle.

When a benchrest rifle is considered "worn out" at 10,000 rounds, a prone guy would say his rifle is just barely "broken in".

Is a nylon brush not "agressive enough" to get down to bare steel? I dunno..
But it gets down below the crud for me, and returns me to a condition where I know I can shoot 500-600 shots in competition and not have to clean between targets (which is typically impractical in a prone match).

I think the difference is this;
A benchrest shooter will clean to get the absolute razors edge of 50 yard accuracy (most .22 bench sports being 50 yard events).
A Prone shooter doesn't need the same razors edge (our targets are a good deal more generous.. the x ring is the size of the IR50-50 7 ring as I recall..)...
What a prone shooter is looking for is STABILITY.  I need to know how my rifle performs over a 1600agg match, because I most likely will not clean it during the match. My rifle will take about 30 shots to "settle" into a stable shooting condition after cleaning, after that, I know what to expect for the next several hundred rounds. 
Typically, nice round groups of under 1" at 100 yards as long as I keep my head out of my posterior and pay attention to my position, hold, sight picture, trigger control, and follow-through.

As a prone shooter, I have better ways to spend my time than cleaning a bore that will shoot all-X cleans when it's dirty (well, with someone else driving it will... and HAS!).

If others want to use a bronze/brass brush.. fine.. I personally don't think it's possible to hurt a bore with a brass/bronze brush unless you hook it up to a drill and lean on it for an hour...
My patch pull through and nylon brush has served me quite well thus far.  I save my brass brushes for if my rifle gets rained on and I'm doing a COMPLETE disassembly, clean, dry, and lube job on it. Then since it's out of the stock anyway, and it'll be 300 shots before it settles back in perfectly... I may give it a scrubbing.

I welcome disagreement with my methods.. but don't expect me to get too worked up defending them, 'cause there's a whole BUNCH of ways to achieve the same goal with a .22 (hitting the X-ring!). And even MORE opinions about how to do it!
Nothing I do is the "perfect" way to do anything... but it works for me.

Paul F.

To be honest, he doesn't make a lot of sense to me on this point, especially when you read his last post on the thread.  His prefered method of cleaning is fairly radical in my opinion and I'll not be adopting it any time soon. 

So, you wil have to read and parse it for yourself I'm afraid.  It's at 
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)

I thought the 35-50 was the disallowed cartridge?  These days, he seems to be reinventing eliptical bullet noses - near identical to the original Sharps long range bullet.  Some of his ideas are pretty good, but some I am sure would not stand up to rigorous testing.  He seems to be the obvious choice to adopt standard testing techniques, yet he never does.  Hard to figure.

Meanwhile Joe, I have lost my mind and bought another low wall.  A schutezen with two barrels, two breach seaters, 5 moulds, ....  a .25-20SS and .25-357.  What in the world am I thinking???  Are you contagious?  

Brent

I dunno, haven't even seen it.  I'm more interested in the .25-20, unless the .25-357 max turns to be suited for bp.  Very doubtful though. 

That being the case, a barrel and breech seater and a  mold or two may be for sale soon.

Brent

Paul, the points you,ve made about the different disciplines are valid. I don't know where you came to the opinion about .22 barrel wear. There are several guys pushing well above 50,000 rounds with top performance. Deneen won a national championship with a barrel with well over 40,000 rounds through it. The real issue on the rod is less about flex under pressure and more about driver-error, keeping it straight on the push-through.