Hi, I'm Bret, a moderator on castbooilts.gunloads.com. We're trying to get all the various gun and hunting forums together to form a grass roots push for our gun rights. The recent Zumbo debacle showed what we can do. So I'm asking you to please join us and get something going. I'm hoping we can distribute info among the boards and get the memberships active. NRA, etc. Should be doing this, but they aren't. Maybe if we start getting active they'll work with us instead of just begging for our money. The current site is at (You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) It's just starting and we hope it'll fly. This isn't a power struggle among the boards and we don't want that. I'm hoping the Moderators and Webmasters can advise the groups as opposed to having all the memberships involved as it seems there'd be lees problems that way. Please stop by and join us in this.

BTW- I'm just a regular guy trying to help get this going. So any help you can offer would be appreciated. Thanks

Amen to what 1878 said. The NRA has become the National Lawyers and Lobbyist Association. Competitave shooting has become an after thought for them. The NRA has its uses, but we as single shot shooters are are not high on the pecking order to them. I consider that a good thing. The last thing that I want is the NRA telling us how to run our programe. I have always felt that the ASSRA is a shooter up organisation, and I would hate to loose that.

40 Rod

Like our leading Amphibian, I had chosen not to reply... but I've changed my mind.

The NRA has shifted from a hunting/collecting/competitive shooting organization, to one that is 95% lobbying and political, which is a function that we DO DESPERATELY NEED...

However, NRA's dominance in running, promoting, and supporting competitive shooting, except for the outstanding dedication of the Competitive Shooting division, is a left over legacy of the past. 

NRA's presence in competitive shooting has become an afterthought to the organization as a whole, despite some excellent people in Competitive Shooting Division.
They don't have the budget or the support they should have from the rest of NRA.

Even at the Nationals, I have heard quite a number of long time shooters comment "this is ridiculous! We paid $900 in match fees, and they have ONE PERSON in the pits handing out water?" and simillar comments.  NRA has been collecting TEN TIMES the amount in Match Fees all over the country than they EVER spend on the Competitive Shooting division.


All that said..
I don't oppose a separate Political Talk sub-forum.
It IS a subject we NEED to be aware of, and STAY aware of. "We must hang together, or we will surely all hang separately".


It still saddens me to see the shooting sports as a whole dying.
Regional Highpower and Smallbore matches that I've attended that once drew hundreds of shooters now can barely bring enough shooters to make class awards in some classes.  The nearest Highpower Range up in Oregon one supported more than 80 firing points and they got USED. Now they have abandoned all but 25 or so target carriers, and only use most of those but once or twice a year.

Without some increase in support by NRA and OTHER groups, we do not have much future in the organized competitive shooting world.


Just my opinion!
Paul F.

Without the NRA and the reforms (ILA, politics, lobbying, etc) introduced by Neal Knox in 1977, we would have NO rifles to shoot, we'd have to go back to using crossbows like the early Schuetzen shooters!

Like it or not, the NRA is the ONLY thing standing between us and gun confiscation! And when I say it's the only thing, I mean the NRA is the 10,000 lb elephant in the room and all the rest of the pro-gun effort is largely ignored.
Ostriches hide their heads, men face and solve problems. JMO, Joe

SPG had posted this on the WSU forum, and thought I'd do as he wished:

Posted: Fri Mar 30, 2007 7:36 am    Post subject: Let someone else do it...         
Gentlemen,
I would have posted this on the ASSRA website in reply but for some reason couldn't get on it.

Someone posted with the idea of banding together the websites in order to appraise members of upcoming gun legistlation...not a bad idea at all.

I was rather shocked to see how many ASSRA members took the stance "I don't like the NRA because all they do is fight anti-gun legistlation...they don't put on any matches for me."

My opinion is...if the NRA successfully fights the anti-gunners, I can put on my own matches. I know that they seem to be a pack of lawyers and lobbyists...but that's precisely what we need to counter the anti-gun groups!

I guess I was a little amazed at the short-sighted view that some of the ASSRA members presented. I assumed that we were all a little more savvy that?

The attitude of "what's in it for me?" is exactly what the anti-gun crowd is banking on. I'm no fan of the way that the NRA runs competitions but as long as they keep the Schumer crowd at bay I support them 100%.

I seriously question the thought processes of someone who says they they can't be bothered with discussions on upcoming gun legistlation when they are a gun owner. I guess the idea is "let someone else do it".

History is full of examples of how well that works.

Gute Ziele,

Steve

The political attack on shooting is not just on "easily concealable handguns" like single action armies with 7 1/2" barrels, and "military assualt weapons" like Ruger 10-22s, there are sneak attacks on ANY use of lead, production of primers poisoning the environment, noise, etc, etc, etc going on beneath the radar all the time.   

Have you priced primers this year?  That increase was the direct result of POLITICAL pressure from antigunners who are working through the tree hugger lobby.  Wait until you can't get ANY lead...what will you shoot out of your beloved Pope or Schoyen then, or will you be content to just watch it hanging on the wall (until the gun gestapo comes to take it away because it is a "potential sniper weapon" designed to shoot precisely at long distances.)   

If there are no guns or no way to shoot them, we can sit around by our computers and wonder what happened, but it will be WAAAY too late by then, regardless of who is organizing matches!   

Again, knowledge is strength, and if there is an informational page on this forum to keep us abreast of these things, what will it hurt?  If anything inflammatory is posted, our moderator (or his designee) has the power to remove it almost immediately.  If a member wishes to ignore what is going on (until the knock comes on HIS door) he may simply not click on that page.   

OK, what IS the official board position?  Should we bring it up at the general meeting in May, or can we contact a BofD member and ask it be put on the agenda of the next board meeting, or what?  I don't think we have a precedent for this since we only entered the practice of maintaining this web site relatively recently.   

Charlie Shaeff, aka Green Frog
ASSRA Life
NRA Life
yada, yada, yada

If we don't watch out, the proposed ban on .50BMG will encompass all the old .50 caliber BPCR rifles right in with it. This is a perfect example of why we need to look out for everyone, not just ouselves!

No organization is perfect and that includes the NRA. Aside from championships, NRA competitive shooting is made up of matches held at local affiliated clubs. That being the case, Mr. Paul F., what are YOU doing to increase your local club membership or participation at matches? The decline in participation is as much due to a decline in interest in shooting as to anything else. It is up to each of us to persuade a new person to put away thier video game and come out and try shooting. To blame NRA for this is to me like blaming the government for my grass not being cut.
SPG mentioned not always being in agreement with the way NRA runs matches. I see this a lot from guys who compete at Raton in the silhouette championships - more than I see or hear it from other disciplines. Maybe it is true. I find it interesting that the complaints here are from SS shooters and the complaints from Raton are from SS shooters. Makes me wonder how we come across to those outside our fraternity or why they would want for long to try to please such a recalcitrant lot.   
As to the cost of shooting matches, that is simple math. Rising costs in general coupled with fewer participants means higher fees for those who do compete. As to water boys in the pits, it is my understanding that those are volunteers. One high power shooter I know has a wife who makes the trip to Perry with him faithfully just to volunteer for those type of duties. 

I may not convince anyone to change his/her thinking on this but I trust my intelligence and have lived long enough to not care if I am agreed with or not.