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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Win 1885 - Thick Side vs Octagon Top  acti (Read 38638 times)
Recoil Rob
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Re: Win 1885 - Thick Side vs Octagon Top  act
Reply #30 - Apr 23rd, 2007 at 12:08am
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Joe, thank you very much for the assessment of my situation, I appreciate your candor. If I went to the 38-55 do you feel it would be OK with the smokeless factory loads or just hand rolled BP's?

marlinguy's idea about repairing the old barrel has merit, I may go that way.

And just for my own info, where can I find out more about these old BP cartridges, inof such as size of the base? Looking through the JC book I see it was chambered for a 32 Ballard Extra Long, would Cartridges of the World have drawing of these? 

Thanks, Rob



Thanks, Rob
  

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Green_Frog
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Re: Win 1885 - Thick Side vs Octagon Top  acti
Reply #31 - Apr 23rd, 2007 at 7:56am
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Rob,

     Unfortunately the Cartridges of the World varies pretty widely in whether and which cartridges have detailed drawings, but for each chapter there is a table that has a more-or-less complete set of cartridge and case dimensions...expecially base and neck diameter, case and overall length, etc.  This may help.  Smiley

     As this part of the thread has rolled out, I was beginning to think along the same lines as my far Southern buddy, JD Steele that a case based on the .30 Krag/.303 Brit pattern and as long as you want or could find would make a nice "brass panatella" for you.  Wink  A CASE you might look at is the .444 Marlin.  This is availble off-the-shelf and has that case size, but is probably a bit shorter than you would like to see.  I would feel good about this in a high-wall, but that is JMHO, of course.  Cool

     One nice thing about working with that high-wall, just about any cartridge of the time was available in it at one time or another, so if it will go in the barrel you use (keeping to the small shank dimension) it will be "right" for that rifle.  Cheesy

     As for further harming the collector value of the original barrel, if it's messed up already, it's messed up.  Campbell's book showed some salvage techniques for peening metal back into place, and of course there is always the welding possibility, and if you wish to "restore" the rifle, that possibility is there.  BTW, dod we ever establish exactly which profile this barrel actually has?

Froggie
  
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Brent
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Re: Win 1885 - Thick Side vs Octagon Top  acti
Reply #32 - Apr 23rd, 2007 at 10:34am
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HST,
I don't want to highjack this thread too far afield, but I would like to know what you use for that bluing on your wedding band barrel.  It sure loojs good.

What did you polish it to?  I'm working on my Borchart barrel now and I'm thinking of taking it down to at least 800 grit.  The best barrel I've done so far, I polished out to 1000.

I think the suggestion for a .28-30 Stevens Panatella is a great idea too.  That's a nice long case that would work well with the highwall action and looks good to.   

Brent
  
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3sixbits
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Re: Win 1885 - Thick Side vs Octagon Top  act
Reply #33 - Apr 23rd, 2007 at 12:57pm
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Quote:
Joe, thank you very much for the assessment of my situation, I appreciate your candor. If I went to the 38-55 do you feel it would be OK with the smokeless factory loads or just hand rolled BP's?

marlinguy's idea about repairing the old barrel has merit, I may go that way.

And just for my own info, where can I find out more about these old BP cartridges, inof such as size of the base? Looking through the JC book I see it was chambered for a 32 Ballard Extra Long, would Cartridges of the World have drawing of these? 

Thanks, Rob



Thanks, Rob

                                                                                                                                                                                                                 
May I suggest to you that you look at Ken Howell"s Book "designing and forming CUSTOM CARTRIDGES".
  
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hst
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Re: Win 1885 - Thick Side vs Octagon Top  acti
Reply #34 - Apr 24th, 2007 at 12:42am
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Brent:

I could tell you, but....


I am not absolutely sure how fine I polished that barrel. I polished it higher than normal because it was one of the pieces presented to the Guild in the white. The greatest secret to being a machinist: If you make it shiny, no one will measure it.

I believe it was finished to 600 and then it was burnished with "Way Fine" grade ScotchBrite. The light gray stuff. The blue did come out quite well and I am going to experiment with finer finishes and see just how bright a rust blue can be done. I suspect that this barrel is about the practical limit.

The bluing is nothing real fancy, just slow and labor intensive. I use one pass with Laurel Mountain Blue/Brown and then all subsequent passes are with Pilkingtons. Usually 10 to 12.  I let each coat of solution sit for about 6 hours and then boil. Carding is done dry and the next coat of solution is applied when the barrel has cooled.

I do not use a damp box. I just set the barrels out on a shelf in the shop. Typical domestic humidity is adequate for the rusting.

I know you are a fan of the Winrest blue, but I had Mr. Kay blue a barrel for me and frankly was disappointed. As a matter of fact it was the last straw that made me decide to learn to blue myself.

So there you have it. All the news that's fit to print.

Glenn Fewless






  
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Brent
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Re: Win 1885 - Thick Side vs Octagon Top  act
Reply #35 - Apr 24th, 2007 at 8:03am
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Cool.  Pilkingtons eh?   

I'll have to try it.  Not against something different.  I too almost never use a rust box.  Just no need and sometimes it can go too fast.  Especially since I'm never around for an entire day anyway.  Just treat it once in the morning, once at night.  With two cycles a day, I'm done in a week.

I'm having a devil of a time getting a finish on my Krieger barrel.  They must have made them out of carbide or somthing.  I can't scratch the beast.  Oh well.  It's just my elbow afterall...

Thanks!
Brent
  
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3sixbits
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Re: Win 1885 - Thick Side vs Octagon Top  acti
Reply #36 - Apr 24th, 2007 at 12:50pm
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Hey guys, you got to try this stuff Rodney Storie sent me. It is the best I've ever used or seen. Ol Rodney was right about this stuff. It's called MARK LEE EXPRESS BLUE # 1. I'm burning my old plywood rust box.
  
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Green_Frog
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Re: Win 1885 - Thick Side vs Octagon Top  acti
Reply #37 - Apr 24th, 2007 at 1:14pm
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"As a matter of fact it was the last straw that made me decide to learn to blue myself. "
 
Now that you have learned to blue yourself, does that make you a...


GUNSMURF??   Grin  Grin  Grin  Grin  Grin

The Green One
  
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Brent
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Re: Win 1885 - Thick Side vs Octagon Top  acti
Reply #38 - Apr 24th, 2007 at 1:53pm
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I have seen a Mark Lee bluing on a very very fancy Ballard done by Jim Westberg in MSP.  The rifle was featured in an engraving publication as a matter of fact.  A to-die-for rifle.   

Brent
  
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3sixbits
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Re: Win 1885 - Thick Side vs Octagon Top  acti
Reply #39 - Apr 24th, 2007 at 2:29pm
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This stuff even makes it fun to do. If you ever saw the contraptions, the mess, the trouble I used to go through, you'd laugh to see how much better this MARK LEE stuff is. P.S. Brent: Brownell's has "dakind".
  
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hst
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Re: Win 1885 - Thick Side vs Octagon Top  acti
Reply #40 - Apr 24th, 2007 at 2:31pm
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Green_Frog wrote on Apr 24th, 2007 at 1:14pm:
"As a matter of fact it was the last straw that made me decide to learn to blue myself. "
 
Now that you have learned to blue yourself, does that make you a...


GUNSMURF??   Grin  Grin  Grin  Grin  Grin

The Green One




And here I thought we were supposed to embrace our diversity.


Glenn
  
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Recoil Rob
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Re: Win 1885 - Thick Side vs Octagon Top  act
Reply #41 - Apr 24th, 2007 at 11:30pm
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Just some more info about my gun. The barrel size isn't marked ahead of the forend. The (round) barrel is 28" long and measures 0.885 just ahead of the shank and 0.735 at the muzzle. Closest in size to a No.1 I guess. The only mark is the VP, violent proof.

Also, someone questioned the originality of the forend, here's a picture. It has the ebony insert, schnable and is 10-1/8" long.

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Green_Frog
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Re: Win 1885 - Thick Side vs Octagon Top  acti
Reply #42 - Apr 25th, 2007 at 10:43am
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Yep, in clear view that looks righteous.  Smiley

I had one that had blackened like that from handling, and used Formby's Furniture Polish to clean it up.  It really made the wood look better.  As for an unmarked (for size) barrel, that may be a function of its extremely early production.  Meanwhile, finding one the same size and using the original wood is looking like a good way to restore, unless you want to go through profiling a new barrel to match.  The project is looking better all the time!   Cheesy

Froggie
  
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Recoil Rob
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Re: Win 1885 - Thick Side vs Octagon Top  act
Reply #43 - Apr 25th, 2007 at 11:07am
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Thanks Froggie, I'm seriously considering leaving it with the original barrel, brand new barrel would look out of place on that gun. I took a closer look at the bore, all the rifling is there, the lands look OK  but there is roughness in the grooves. Might shoot, worth a try.
  

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Brent
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Re: Win 1885 - Thick Side vs Octagon Top  acti
Reply #44 - Apr 25th, 2007 at 11:11am
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Have it relined if it needs it.
Brent
  
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